One aspect of Christianity that may sometimes be overlooked in Christian fantasy is the “religious” side of Christianity. The “Christians” in a secondary world Tolkien’s term for a fantasy world tend to believe in God, pray occasionally, and seek to live righteously, but what about their interaction with other believers and the natural order that comes to their faith? Do believers assemble together for “church”? (Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another. -- Hebrews 10:25a) Do they have a temple or churches? What about holy days and other special days? Do theologians write about their faith? Do musicians compose songs about their faith? (Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord. -- Ephesians 5:19)

There are two ways this can be approached: The more formal, Law-oriented faith of the Old Testament, before the Savior had come; and the less formal, grace-oriented faith of the New Testament, after the Savior had come. In the former, there are priests and rituals, though still freedom for those who truly love God. (I will walk about in freedom, for I have sought out Your precepts. -- Psalm 119:45) In the latter, there are simply pastors and more direct communication with God because of salvation through the Savior and the coming of the Holy Spirit. (The law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. -- Hebrews 3:24-25)

What are your thoughts on Christianity in a secondary world? Do you have Christianity in your secondary world? If so, do you prefer to write about our faith as it was under law or as it is now under grace? Do you think it is easier to write about Christianity under law or under grace, or do both present a variety of challenges to overcome? Have you read any Christian fantasy novels that portrayed Christianity in a secondary world? What did you think of these portrayals, and what were they like? Did they portray Christianity as under law or as it is now under grace? Did you find them effective, and if so, why?

It's awesome.

Yep, yep, yep!

The latter.

Under grace.

Err...I read the first Dragon King book by Stephen Lawhead, and skimmed over the other two...It kinda had something like that...

Looking back, I don't think the portrayal was too great...However, as it was a long time ago, I don't believe that me commenting would be too proper.

I do know that there was no Scripture or anything of the sort.

It was under grace.

As for effectiveness, I would need to read over the book, and probably the whole trilogy, again. I don't remember how much of a part it played, or how well of one.
God bless,
Joel ><>.

I have portrayed Christianity under law. Maybe it's because I'm lazy, but I didn't feel comfortable transposing our faith directly into a new world. Thus, I've decided that just as the Old Testament points forward to Christ, my novels can do the same.

eru

From what I've been working on thus far, these kinds of questions tend to apply more to my worldbuilding than to my storytelling. It's important for me as an author to know how religion works in the lands I'm creating, but unless something about how the common folk practice religion is particularly relevant to the story, that information may not pop up in the text. Holy days, theologians and worship leaders tend to fall under that heading.

Each of my worlds has a slightly different set-up, but overall the believers tend to live under grace and attempt to live by what C.S. Lewis referrred to as the "Natural Law," or the common decency that tends to be less common than we'd like sometimes. At this point I haven't decided whether any of these worlds has had its Calvary event yet. They all have some form of Church, though I tend to shy away from a full priesthood since I don't want an intermediary to be necessary between my characters and God. There are religious leaders, but their actual authority varies.

*pokes Airianna* Are you thinking what I'm thinking? Blog post!

This is an absolutely wonderful post, Jonathan, and extremely good points. I think you're right - it seems like the "ritual" side of religion is often neglected in fantasy that portrays Christianity.

I'm actually worried about this in some of my novels that portray Christianity. Not everyone knows this, but I haven't gone to church in several years. There's a long story behind that, and it's not because my family is against church. The exact opposite, really. But I won't derail the thread - the point is, I don't go, and therefore I tend to leave it out of my stories unintentionally.

You might have noticed - there's no reference to church in Red Rain, despite the overt Christianity. I don't think it's a problem for that book in particular, but for future books it's something I want to watch.

Most of the time, if I have Christianity in a book, the story is set in the world, though perhaps a fictional time/place. Therefore, I usually follow the traditional rules and customs that I've grown up with. However, since it is a fictional culture, perhaps the customs should be a bit more tailored to the novel... *eagerly watches the replies on this thread*

Great thoughts, Jonathan!

I haven't written a lot of fantasy, and so far the bit that I've written tends to be either allegorical or without defined Christianity, but I've given this a lot of thought in sci-fi settings. Because most of my sci-fi is futuristic, it's almost like creating a fantasy world in some ways.

I'm in very much the same boat with Phil. I haven't been to church in years, much to my grief. It has not been my decision. But for that reason, I too tend to unconsciously leave church and rituals out. In Firmament, Andi and the Doctor don't go to church, because there is none on the ship -- but it seems like it would be a good idea to have them meet with any other believers on the ship.

Or in Implant, there is no church or religious rituals because the main group is under excessive attack, basically like war time. In fact, there's no mention of religion at all in the story. It's presumed that the main characters are not Christians.

But these are things I should think about more. If Christianity exists, whether in another world or another version of this world, then, as you say, it will have its rituals and traditions.


I think it's wonderful when done right, tragic when done wrong, and not always necessary.


In Learsi, not really, though there is a God as well as a Christ. In The Ending, no.


The current Learsi book is on the law and on the verge of being under grace, but I think either is interesting.


They both have different kinds of challenges. Under law may be slightly on the harder side, as it's stricter, and probably darker. Under grace, however, can become tricky when you have Christ characters, because that is tremendously hard to pull off.


Not Christianity as such, though I've read allegorical (or "supposal") versions, like in Narnia and TiraNor.


In Narnia, Lewis does an incredible job, most of you are familiar with that. He has a Christ figure who is sacrificed for the sins of another, which has always been a powerful example to me since I was a little kid.

In TiraNor, the God is named Elshua, and is not a "character" really. It's more like the real God. Elshua is unseen, but empowers characters and speaks to their hearts, and very obviously guides the events of the world. Elshua is spoken of often.


In Narnia, both, though the majority of the books are grace, I suppose.

In TiraNor, as the books are retellings of Old Testament Bible stories, they are under law, in the sense that there is no church, no Savior, and Elsuha's will is given through Seers (prophets).


I found Narnia very effective, because of the way Aslan is portrayed. Loving, but firm, truthful, kind, terrible, forgiving, wonderful. It helped me see Jesus better.

TiraNor was also effective, the way that Elshua gives strength to JaRed at the moments where he needs it most, sometimes with just a whisper of hope.

I don't know if that answers your questions, I know you weren't really talking about allegorical Christianity. But maybe those examples will give insight anyway? Thanks for the great thoughts!

(and forgive me for the extremely long post... )

Lots of good thoughts.


I figured that was coming.


Actually, I was generally (though not exclusively) talking about allegorical Christianity, since most fantasy novels aren't going to have Christianity carried over from our world.


You should know by now we tend to like those.

Well, then, since you knew it was coming, you can go ahead and start working on adapting your article into a blog post encouraging writers to think about these areas of Christianity. (Or however you want to take the article.) Yes?

I didn't say I necessarily agreed, just that I figured there was a possibility it would be suggested at some point.

*has been poked *

Yep, yep, great minds think alike. You better get cracking, Jonathan.

*nods, satisfied*

I was going to snip that quote down, but couldn't find a good place to do it. And I'll note in passing that the phrasing of the question presupposes a Law/Grace duality that Lutherans emphasize and Calvinists deny. (To over-simplify things, to avoid derailing the thread. But the more I look into various doctrinal questions, studying the relevant Scriptural passages and the historical teaching of the Church, the more I find myself agreeing with the Reformed schools of thought.)

The portrayal of Christianity in a secondary world is a question that I have put a not-insignificant amount of thought into already, and which I need to think about a lot more. In my world, most people have been Christians since the beginning, since it was settled by "sons of Adam and daughters of Eve" from other worlds, including ours. And so a Church developed there, one that is rather different in form, practice, and doctrine from any of our denominations.

And then, in the year 110 (though that may change when I finally get around to revising the timeline ...), over a hundred people from our world ("the Chosen") arrive, again mostly Christian, but more or less committed to a variety of denominations, including Anglicans, Roman Catholics, probably Lutherans, Calvinists of various stripes, Baptists, and so on. Once the crisis they arrived in the middle of passed, to try to prevent any religious conflict or schism, the King convened an ecumenical council. I don't yet know what was debated at that council, or what its results were, except that there continued to be one Church across the entire Empire for the next century and more, with no local bodies breaking communion with any other local bodies. And some local churches are highly liturgical (which I prefer myself, as it happens), with at least one ecumenically-uniform liturgy (since I mention in one WIP---my submission to this month's Writing Circle, as it happens---in passing something like ".. the monastic Hours, as revised by the first, and so far only, Council of Capitol ..."), but some are much more informal. This is a worldbuilding problem I need to devote a lot more thought to ...

Well, I don't write allegory, so I don't tend to have these sort of questions rattling around in my brain. And for the record, Andi, Leah, I don't go to church either. We can sit around and talk about that sometime.

However one thought came to mind about why it might be that you don't see fantasy characters going to church... do you see fantasy characters go to school very often? Engage in ordinary duties? Usually they only get a brief moment before they're snatched out of their ordinary lives and thrown into the non-stop action of the story. In other words, they're so busy with what God has thrown into their lives that they don't have time for ritual.


I think it is very, very, very hard to pull off successfully and well and thus I avoid it.


That would be a post I could ramble on about all day... I have written one book that's a sort of allegory. The rest of them have a sort of vague impression that just sort of leaves a trail through the story that's never quite identified.


Honestly, I have no clue.


Both have a myriad of challenges. Both have a diversity of problems and pitfalls.


Narnia, of course. The Dark is Rising series had it, a bit. I'm stuck half way through the Restorer, which is very Christian.


Narnia is brilliant. Actually, I think the brilliance of Narnia is one of the reasons allegories so rarely work for me. Who can beat that?
The Dark is Rising might have Christianity in it, but it cheapens it. I didn't like it at all.
The Restorer... *sigh* I haven't finished it. So far it... it's like reading a typical Christian book that's attempting to be a fantasy book, so I guess it completely personifies Christian Fantasy.


Under Grace. I think.


Narnia yes, Restorer no, and I think I already said that up there somewhere...

As far as simply portraying ritualistic church services:
A lot of my books are just so vague, one way or another. I have a sort of science fiction sort of novel that really wants to be a TV show that starts with a church service. It's not a religious book, so I don't talk about the religion, so it could be some form of Christianity. It's a very strict village, very puritanical.

In the Last Wizard one of the main characters is the village priest. He conducts rituals for the dead, he holds meetings every week. I don't talk about his religion either, but it's implied that he's a catholic priest. It's implied, not specified, because I want that culture without the history. 'Tis a fantasy world, after all.

I used to have almost as big an issue with writing weddings as I did with writing wars. I didn't know how one could have a wedding without a Bible, and how one could have a Bible in a fictional world. Nightmares of a beginning writer...

That said, ritual and religion does play a big part in weddings, or any sort of thing. Lightning Ranger deals with a truckload of different religions, and so I have ritual to go along with that. The curious thing about Christianity in that story is that it's the one religion that doesn't have a ritual associated. It's the one hope he's offered that doesn't have any physical form. There's no name for it, he doesn't know anyone who follows it, there's nowhere to go, nothing to do... just accept that it exists...

Shall I keep rambling or is this post too long already?

A lot of what my personal definition of the church body is, is simply people, like-minded people, fellowshipping together. It's not a ritual, it's not some formula that has to be followed. It's the gathering of the outcasts in the cave they're forced to live in to talk, to dance, to be together for an evening before the next days work begins. I show that in City of Lies, and while the only religion I mention in that one is a pagan one I think their daily gathering is as much a church service as anything else.

A very wonderful post, Katie, and a good point about normal life being disrupted. That doesn't negate the issue, but some plots can probably justify not dealing with those sorts of mundane things just because of the extremity of the events.

Also a good point that religion plays a huge role in the rituals revolving around weddings at the like. When we translate those traditions to a fantasy world, we may take away the religion, but we keep the externals that hail back to religious beginnings. Curious thought...

I have a question related to this topic.
Let's say I've created a fantasy world, and I, as a Christian author, would like to have distinctly Christian characters (not just moralistic or nice with ethical basis), how can that be handled if I don't want to go the allegory route? Basically, is there a way to handle this if I don't want to allegorically recreate the entire Biblical set-up?
What do you all think?

There's no one "right" answer to this question; there's been at least two threads here discussing it or related topics since I joined last summer (one and two). The way I'm handling it is to make the world in which most of my stories are set have been mostly settled by Christians, but I know a lot of other authors have their own approaches.

(Oh, and as an aside:

In my opinion, "allegorically recreate the entire Biblical set-up" is a contradiction in terms. (Sorry, this is one of my pet peeves.) Allegory is a specific literary form, in which there are two layers of story going on, and just about everything (setting, characters, actions, events ...) in the "inner story"---which is the only one the author actually, explicitly tells---represents something in the outer story. The Faerie Queene is an allegory, as are Pilgrim's Progress and Lewis's Pilgrim's Regress; Narnia is not. I would love to see a real allegory along the lines of the Faerie Queene; it's the retellings and blatantly-symbolic-but-not-allegorical stories that get so tiresome for me.)

Thanks for your thoughts and the links! I especially found Aubrey's thoughts to be paralleling my own (as-yet-semi-unformed) thoughts on the topic...

"...As my mother says, the Bible was given to the sons of Adam on this earth only. So in Erde, my fantasy universe, there is no Bible, nor do I have an allegorical equivalent. However, I can quote Scripture in chapter headings, and my MC comes from our world, so he keeps his Christianity in mind. Essentially, he interprets everything he experiences with a Biblical worldview. It's quite fun. It allows me to have a Christian worldview without bringing the religion into a fantasy world."

*is very glad to see Perry on HW*

Jon makes a good point about allegory. I assume what you meant, Perry, is that you didn't want to write something like Narnia where you have a Christ-figure like Aslan who fulfills the same spiritual function in your world. I personally do not do this because I do not feel comfortable representing God in this way. However, I will read some books (like Narnia) that do.

I think it makes perfect sense and should never be ignored when a Christian is writing a novel of any sort, after all what is the real purpose of a novel, even if it is moral, if it ignores the source of morals?

The law, separate from its source, is basically non-law.



Yes I do.



Under grace.



I'm honestly not sure about this. I think I'd probably enjoy both, challenges are my thing.



Narnia, but it's been a long time and I don't remember much.




Under grace I believe.



Yes, I thought it was quite effective if I remember correctly.

_
I find these question rather interesting I believe that I took an unusual and entirely different take on things in that my world takes place post-resurrection. The New Earth has already been established. However, all of the races in my world of Tira were created from the ribs of mankind. They are equal to him and because they were taken from him. Christ's redemption applies to them as well. Christ doesn't need to redeem them because they've already been redeemed, all they need to do is discover the truth. Mankind prepared the world of Tira for it's new inhabitants and we are known to them as the Ancients.

An excellent point, Katie!

Hmmm...this really makes me think. It seems to me that in a Christian fantasy, there are people who believe in God, but they seem to be loners. I don't get the impression that they gather in churches to worship God together.
Hmmm...