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 Post subject: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 13th, 2012, 11:34 pm 
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Hello, all! I joined HW some time ago but am just now getting around to actually getting involved. Please forgive any newcomer's clumsiness. ;)
I have a situation in a WIP that I'd love to get some outside opinions on. In my fictional world, Reyem, there is an order of sorcerers (the bad guys) who undergo an initiation process consisting of a cut being made in their scalp in concert with a lot of incantations by an order master, etc. All magical power in Reyem is demon-based, and this ceremony is essentially an applicant's request, directed to a demon, to be accepted into the order.
If the hair along the scar from the cut grows back in white, the applicant has been accepted. If not, tough luck.
The problem I'm having is this: I have a character who is a sorceress (white streak in her hair and all) who later turns from that path to follow the True God. I'm torn trying to decide whether the white streak in her hair should still be there since it's the result of a permanent scar, or if it should start growing out and be replaced by her natural color since it was connected to her alliance with demons.
Any thoughts or suggestions will be appreciated. :)

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"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 14th, 2012, 7:03 am 
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Hmm. You said that if a person where not accepted by the demon's, then their hair would not turn white even with the scar. Therefore, I would assume that when the demon left her the scar would gradually return to her natural hair color.

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 14th, 2012, 7:53 am 
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Hrm, fascinating concept! The thing about things like this is that even though there is redemption through Jesus for those who have made horrible mistakes and done evils in their lives, the redemption does not always erase the consequences of past actions. If you left the white streak there, it would give you a lot of opportunities to grow the character through the trials they may face from others over having it, and in the end, it may also be a powerful witnessing tool to others. Just a thought! :D

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 14th, 2012, 9:27 am 
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It really could be either, I think. It's a question of whether the white hair is a one time event that stays forever, or if it's a continuous thing that depends on the alliance with demons. Either could be easily justified, I think.

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 14th, 2012, 12:36 pm 
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Another idea might be to have it fade, but only to gray. It's clear there has been a change, but the mark partly remains.

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 15th, 2012, 12:15 am 
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Good thoughts. Thank you all! :D
Bushmaid's comment brought something else to mind: namely, that the overarching theme of the book and its sequel is dealing with the regrets that come with redemption (hence the title Redemption's Regrets). So if the white streak in her hair remains as a physical reminder of her spiritual past, it might tie in very nicely with the theme. Why didn't I think of this before?
Again, thank you all!

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"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: July 22nd, 2012, 7:16 am 
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You're welcome! Glad I could help. :D

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 3rd, 2012, 7:58 am 
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I would leave the white streak. People who smoke suffer ireversible throat and lung damage, people who do drugs permanently alter their minds and bodies. The scar, and the white streak, are physical consequences and should remain.

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I am Ebed Eleutheros, redeemed from slavery in sin to the bond-service of my Master, Jesus Christ.

Redemption is to be purchased, to have a price paid. So I was redeemed from my master sin, and from justice, which demanded my death. For He paid the price of sin by becoming sin, and met the demands of justice by dying for us.

For all men have a master. But a man cannot have two masters. For he will love one and hate the other. You cannot serve God and sin. So I die to the old, as He died, and I am resurrected to the new, as He was resurrected.

Note: Ebed is Hebrew for bondsman, Eleutheros is Greek for unrestrained (not a slave).


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 3rd, 2012, 10:53 am 
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Another thought (one that I probably should have included in my original post): some time after her initial redemption, the ex-sorceress is killed by her former cohort, a sorcerer. But a short time after that she is miraculously brought back to life. I've toyed with the notion of the white streak in her hair staying until that point. When she comes back to life, it disappears.
But I can't decide for sure what the implications of that would be or if I like them. She's still mortal, but all her wounds have been healed - the ones that killed her, anyway. If the white streak disappears at that point, it could be construed to symbolize evil's complete loss of control over her... but on the other hand, evil had already completely lost its hold on her when Christ redeemed her so I don't know if that symbolism would be well-placed or not.
I do know that up until he kills her, her old comrade has taunted her by telling her she's fooling herself and really still belongs to the side he's on, and he's tried to lure her back with promises of incredible power. She knows in her head that he's lying, but she still struggles with doubt and unease in her heart from time to time. The disappearance of her white streak after she comes back to life would be a great form of assurance for her, but that's where this becomes more of a theology issue: is that something God would do, or not?
Taking away her white streak would be a beautiful gift to her, especially since she's still going to have a lot of other regrets and consequences of her past life to deal with so it's not like she's going to forget where she's come from. But would God see such a thing as necessary or beneficial? Because on the other side of the coin leaving the white streak there would be an excellent way to make sure she stays humble.
So to sum up: white streak for sure stays in place after her initial conversion. Question remaining: does it stay in place after she dies and is brought back to life?

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"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 3rd, 2012, 2:52 pm 
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Lady Mhuire wrote:
The disappearance of her white streak after she comes back to life would be a great form of assurance for her, but that's where this becomes more of a theology issue: is that something God would do, or not?
Taking away her white streak would be a beautiful gift to her, especially since she's still going to have a lot of other regrets and consequences of her past life to deal with so it's not like she's going to forget where she's come from. But would God see such a thing as necessary or beneficial? Because on the other side of the coin leaving the white streak there would be an excellent way to make sure she stays humble.
So to sum up: white streak for sure stays in place after her initial conversion. Question remaining: does it stay in place after she dies and is brought back to life?

Having it stay or leave both seem fine theologically. God would choose whether to leave it or not depending on what He foresaw as being best for her. One possible factor is what she would struggle with most down the road: If pride, then the white streak might be left. If the darkness of her past, then the white streak might be removed.

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 3rd, 2012, 3:31 pm 
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Very good point, Jonathan. I think that's what I was trying to wrap my brain around, but just couldn't seem to come at it from the right angle. Thanks so much for your input! :D

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"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 3rd, 2012, 4:44 pm 
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You're welcome, Lady Mhuire. :D

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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 15th, 2012, 10:22 am 
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Do demons actively keep the hair white? Or is it a one time altering?

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And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for you: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather boast in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. ~ 2 Corinthians 12:9

Nessa- She's given up the veil, the vows she'd sworn, abandoned every effort to conform. Without a word to anyone she's gone her way alone, a dove escaping back into the storm.

Nolan- And though I don't understand why this happened, I know that I will when I look back someday, and see how you've brought beauty from ashes, and made me as gold purified through the flames.

Azriel- And who do you think you are, running round leaving scars, collecting your jar of hearts, and tearing love apart? You're gonna catch a cold from the ice inside your soul, so don't come back to me. Don't come back at all...


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 15th, 2012, 10:10 pm 
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It is a one-time thing. I've never really gone in and tried to hash out the details of whether the demons turn the hair white when they accept an apprentice's request to become part of the order, or whether the demons make their decision of whether or not to accept based on whether the hair turns white or not, since that particular detail isn't terribly relevant to the story. But yes, it is a one-time, physical effect.

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"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 16th, 2012, 10:48 am 
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So, if it doesn't mean that she is still under demonic influence, I don't quite understand why you're debating whether to get rid of it or leave it. :)

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And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for you: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather boast in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. ~ 2 Corinthians 12:9

Nessa- She's given up the veil, the vows she'd sworn, abandoned every effort to conform. Without a word to anyone she's gone her way alone, a dove escaping back into the storm.

Nolan- And though I don't understand why this happened, I know that I will when I look back someday, and see how you've brought beauty from ashes, and made me as gold purified through the flames.

Azriel- And who do you think you are, running round leaving scars, collecting your jar of hearts, and tearing love apart? You're gonna catch a cold from the ice inside your soul, so don't come back to me. Don't come back at all...


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 Post subject: Re: An ex-sorceress with a scar...
PostPosted: August 16th, 2012, 11:38 am 
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Because the presence of the white streak is directly related to her acceptance into the demonic order of sorcerers. Regardless of whether the white streak determines the demons' acceptance of her or the demon's acceptance of her determines the white streak, it's still related, and is a very prominent mark used as a sign of what and who she is.

_________________
"Remember, dear brothers and sisters, that few of you were wise in the world's eyes or powerful or wealthy when God called you. Instead, God chose things the world considers foolish in order to shame those who think they are wise. And He chose things that are powerless to shame those who are powerful. God chose things despised by the world, things counted as nothing at all, and used them to bring to nothing what the world considers important. As a result, no one can ever boast in the presence of God." 1 Cor. 1:26-29

~Blessed to be a powerless fool.~


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