So, you all have probably have seen the trailers, the movies, the comic books. But have you seen God through them? How do super heroes reflect man?

I think that when you have a human that has "Super powers", that in a way, it isn't the best thing in the world. Think about it; God created every man equal; there are no lesser or greater men, but when a Super hero comes along, they make us "normal" humans look like pathetic people that can't make change for ourselves. But we can, it's how God made us. I think nothing bad of Super heroes in a different world, but on Earth, I say no. And when you have a "Super hero" you need a "Super Villain" which portrays man as being a screwed up people, that needs humans of a "Higher being" to save us pathetic people, but as I said we aren't! I have raised over 1,000 dollars for "Turn on the tap" which helps save people. I did that with out super powers. Martin Luther King Jr changed the world without Super powers. You influence people through writing, without Super powers.

That is why I say super heroes are a bad influence on you.
Feel free to debate and stand up for "Super heroes".
But this is my belief.

That is interesting...I had never thought about that before. I'm not sure if I'm totally against super heroes (though I'm not really a fan of any anyway...) though.

I completely disagree...
God is my Super Hero, I think that many super hero stories/movies remind me of the sacrifice that Jesus made. It may not be apparent, but I can strain that out of most super heroes.

I disagree on so many levels. First of all, God did not make everyone equal. There most definitely are greater and lesser men. I'm honestly not sure why I even have to argue that point. Some men are smarter than others, some are handsomer than others, some are more virtuous than others, some are harder-working than others...to contend that they're all equal is a position I will never understand.

That alone should show why I don't agree with you. We don't all have equal talents.

Second of all, regarding super villains. Super villains aren't necessarily any more screwed up, morally speaking, than villains of a more mundane sort. They are merely extraordinarily powerful, commensurate with the heroes they fight.

Third of all, regarding your charity work. I heartily congratulate you for it, but I fail to see what it has to do with superheroes. I've never read a superhero story or seen a superhero movie and perceived the message as "ordinary people don't matter." Quite the contrary, in fact. Superheroes risk their lives every day to protect ordinary people precisely because they firmly believe that they do matter. Nor do I see the message as "if you don't have mysterious/magical/superhuman powers you can't change the world." Both Marvel and DC, for instance, have really compelling heroes with no powers at all, right alongside their superhuman allies.

In sum, I think your premises are wrong. And you're drawing the wrong message from superhero tales.

I'm not talking about Physical there, not mental, but us, ordinary people. Are all equal in Gods eye. I can see why you were confused


I truly agree with you there, but when your whole molecular structure can be changed with some Gamma radiation(Like the Hulk). Is un-realistic.


I think that, having tons of really bad, bad guys that are more powerful then the good guy, makes it seem as though there aren't as many good people in our society, thus there aren't as many Super Hero's


I was saying, you can change the world, without super powers.


I'm saying, if ordinary people do matter, why don't they show up a lot more?
Why is only the "Hottest/cutest" girl, that the Super Hero Make out with at the end of the show why is it always them, there are plenty of better girls, instead of the ones that will dump you in a heart beat. I'm not saying that lots of girls do this, but Mary Jane gives us a pretty good example.


I say, you can do it in a non violent way(Like Gandhi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohandas_Karamchand_Gandhi.)
There where many good soldiers that have changed the world without super powers. I also think that Marvel/DC have people that went through years of training, and government work.


I might be drawing the wrong message, I might have a totally messed up premise. I find this side very hard to defend, for a couple of reasons:
1: I came up with it today.
2: I have always been a huge fan of super heros, I went to see Captain America when it came out, just like Thor, Spiderman. I watch a whole season of the Avengers in a week. But I just think that they can have a bad influence.
But I think, that my premise has building blocks, that I can build on.
I just want to say, guard your mind when watching these movies. And also always guard your mind, for society will try to win it.



I agree God is also my Super Hero. But he's so much more then the guy that fights bad guys. He's my father, my brother, my teacher, my healer, and best of all, my friend. And for his sake, and mine. I'm more careful now when watching Super Hero movies.

I only skimmed through this thread, but I'd like to point out several things.

I don't think superheros are a bad influence. Especially with young kids, they can inspire us to noble deeds and a greater honesty, strength and compassion.

True, we're all equal in God's eyes, but we're all different too. Superheros indicate a certain 'specialness', yes, but we've all met people we thought kind of 'extra special'. Not that they are intrinsically, but because their particular gifts and personalities and ideas really clicked with our hearts. Take me... I see nothing 'special' about the conventional superhero. However, for me, fictional characters like Thace in the Bronze Bow are my personal 'superheros'. I emulate and esteem them... even envy them if I'm not careful. I don't think superheros are more dangerous than any other fictional character. Its how the reader views them that makes the difference.

Third, like Ness, I think superheros are a reflection of mankind's intrinsic, unconscious knowledge of the Saviour. Superheros show how small we are... how we need someone who can fly, who can always get there in the nick of time... how very much we need a Rescuer, from both others and our vile selves. Someone who can help us be heros too. Superheros demonstrate our inadequacy, and our need, and I think can often help us realize both.

Sure, superheros can be a bad influence. But then, most things can.

I agree. But they have to be portrayed right.
That's what I'm talking about here, being portrayed. But if I could change one thing, it's that they always have to resort to violence.


Exacly I think, it's all how you view them, I have to say for me, that's where it ends, how you see them. But I just want to say, guard your mind when watching/reading these movies/books. That is what I'm getting at, guarding your mind.


I think out of anyone so far, you gave the best argument that Super Heroes aren't a bad influence.

I wasn't confused, which I hope to demonstrate by these two points:

1. I don't believe we're all equal in God's eyes. Stalin and Mother Theresa, saint and dictator, are not equal in God's eyes. In point of fact, if you believe in Hell, and if you believe some people go there and others don't, and if you believe the choice as to whom is not random, then you acknowledge that God recognizes at least one very serious inequality in humankind.

2. Even if we were all equal in some metaphysical "God's-eye-view" sense, as long as it doesn't mean we all have equal talents, how does it cause problems for superheroes?



Sure it is. Superhero stories have unrealistic physics. Does that make them immoral (or potentially immoral)? I don't see how.



Usually the bad guy is somewhat less powerful, overall, than the good guy, as indicated by his consistent defeats at the good guy's hands.



That's true. But even some superheroes are examples of that.



Well, other things being equal, if you could make out with a more attractive girl or a less attractive girl, what would you do?



Martin Luther King and Gandhi. It might be good to give an example of someone who made a change for the better next time.



Well, I don't think there's any reason to guard your mind any more than when watching any other modern movie, but thanks.

I believe we are all equal in God's eyes, we all deserve hell just as much as others, we don't earn the right to go to heaven. Those of us that are saved are clothed in Christ's righteousness and our sins are washed away, but God still sees "us", or the "old man" as all equally horrid.

But even if you believe as you say, the distinction (inequality) between those "clothed in the righteousness" and those not is recognized by God and critically important.

EDIT: And do you really believe that your sins are as bad as Stalin's?

You're right, being clothed in Christ's righteousness does have an effect on the person, this is what becomes the "new man" the "old man" or your old self, is equal with other men-sinful.

I would like to hear how you reconcile these two verses while I think about it more, and I'm not sure, but this might be getting off-topic (I never was good at recognizing that) so you can PM your thoughts to me, and we can continue our discussion.

Add me to that conversation too!
That was just me showing my personal, distaste.



Some not all.



I would do the one I love(in about ten years). I'm saying the movie company's are trying to get "Eye candy" for men. which I totally hate.



Here:
I don't see how trying ot lead him, and his people into independence is a bad thing.



We was fighting, for all races to walk in peace, I do not see how, that is a "bad cause" they did make a change for the better! They both died because of it. And do I need to bring up, Thomas D'arcy Mcgee?


Sam, I'm saying always guard your mind, don't let society destroy it, like it has to so many people that I know. And I wasn't just talking to you.


I'm not saying, "Don't watch them" I'm not saying "All super hero's are evil things that will kill you." I'm saying, be careful. And that is all.

Maybe it should be a thread then. I propose the title "Are All Sins Equal?"



Oh, OK. You're entitled to that.



But even the ones who aren't share a universe with the ones who are. So the message, at worst, is "super powers make changing the world easier." I don't think you can deny that if super powers existed, that would be true.




Let me ask you then: what is the solution to this perceived problem? Have more superheroes make out with ugly girls? Are you really saying our art should be uglier? That ugliness is somehow a positive value or that beauty is something to be looked down upon or opposed?




I do. Rebellion against his lawful sovereign to establish a nationalistic republic was wrong. And the government so established was founded on principles of equality, and even socialist ideas. I have little good to say about Gandhi.



The Civil Rights Act and the affirmative action and anti-discrimination laws that came afterward were possibly the greatest blow to property rights in American history. As for Mcgee, never heard of him. You can try.

I agree.



I say, not that, but cut the scene to just a peck on the cheek, not a full out, make-out scene. Young children watch them, and they should respect that.



I think he did a great thing, but you can have your own opinion. It's all in the eye of the beholder, eh?
I have debated many times, for civil disobedience.


I agree that they could make the world a lot easier, but not the same way they do them, in movies.

Cool.



I misunderstood. I thought you were objecting, not to the making out as such, but to the choice of partners.



Not really. You have your view; I have mine. One of us is wrong; it's not "in the eye of the beholder." Here is not, however, the place to get into the details of who is wrong and why. But we should be able to agree that our views are not equally valid, even if we can't agree on whose is more valid.



I object to the goals, not so much the methods, of Dr. King and Gandhi.



What do you mean?

Okay, that makes sense now, I'm glad where on the same page now.



Good point, but what I'm getting at is, there is one right one, and one wrong one, but it's up to the beholder to choose which one they believe, does that make sense('Cause I'm not sure if it does)?



Okay, I get ya now.


Let me rephrase that:
Super powers would make the world easier. But not the way the movies/comic books make them, Super powers would be good for stopping crime, but I don't believe in the whole "Super Villian kills half of the people in New York, can't be stopped, oh, wait here comes the Super Hero finally." In other words, I don't believe in the whole Super Villain thing, but I do agree if there where Super Hero's there would be Super Villians, but not the nine realms(Like in Thor.) And Super powers left on the earth, for the "greater" man.

Food for thought:

My friend's nephew is very taken in with superheroes. TV shoes, action figures, movies, everything. So one day my friend tells her nephew about God. How great He is, how He created the world in six days, His might, His miracles, His sacrifice, Jesus Christ, everything.
So the kid is completely stunned. Eyes wide, mouth open, all wowed and everything. It's pretty clear that he is awed by all the things he just realized about God. So he says something to the effect of, "God is really cool and powerful." Then, "I want to be Him."

Not "like Him" but actually be Him.

I've actually never given superheroes a second thought before she told me that, but is there perhaps too great of an emphasis on fictional people in this world becoming more than everyday human beings through some radioactive, scientific, cosmic, etc. event? So much so that the perception of God has become one that lacks reverence in a very big way - one that perhaps introduces the idea of human divinity and a sort of egocentric pantheism?



I thought that it was interesting that this thread should pop up, particularly after the discussion I had with my friend.

Not to derail this discussion, but I think I'm going to retract my offer to continue to discuss whether God views people equally, because I actually don't believe he does, the reason I stepped in was because I was afraid that someone had implied that God made distinctions among people based on something other than his sovereign will (and I'm aware that many people disagree with me on this issue).
And since I've already discussed God's sovereignty in a different thread, I don't really want to again...plus I'm a bit too busy for another theological debate. So I'm sorry I said I would discuss it more, I wasn't thinking about the things listed above at the time.

Okay, that is fair enough.

Remember gang, no debates on HW.
I admire the maturity with which everyone has handled this discussion, but it's drifted awfully close to the realm of debate if not into it already. Not saying "cease and desist!" Just a reminder from your friendly neighborhood Seer.

Thanks for reminding us Seer. It has strayed very close to debate.

Thanks for the reminder Seer. Danko, are you arguing about superheroes or almost any movie made in the last 30 years? If you're arguing about superheroes, then you're being absolutely ridiculous. If superheroes resolved things peacefully, there would be no comics or movies. Who would read a comic or watch a movie about Super Diplomat? Or maybe The Negotiator ? Peaceful resolution of conflict would take away the cool part from superheroes! It would make them normal people!
If you're arguing about movies, I agree with you to an extent. Movies do play up the "eye candy" and explosions, but expecting directors to make movies that are safer for kids or just generally more moral, is expecting them to act more like Christians than the secular culture they are.

To tell you all the truth, I have never really agreed with what I said, my friend brought it up, and I thought I would make a post about it to see what you all think. Although the part about "Eye candy" I do think is bad, but I don't think we should talk about it too much.

Yeah, it can get into the "Tricky Subjects" pretty quick. Ok, with all the defenders of superheroes, maybe you should be a little more specific next time;).

I hate missing all the good topics.

Varon, I'm surprised you weren't in here.

*Laughs* I will. I might start one about Disney princesses.

I'm surprised too.

Hm? Oh. I thought about it. I've just been really busy and suffering from a bad attack of repeated insomnia.