I'm not sure why the White Witch showing up there is so bad. I just assumed that it was caused by the whole place of dreams things. I can see her being pretty much his worst nightmare.

...
I couldn't stand it. It plain and simple creeped me out.
The green mist? The swords? I mean, yeah, it was kind of interesting, but the swords were too much. They made me kind of whoozy and nervous.

And I completely understand why people would be annoyed with them always, always bringing the white witch back in. It irked me as well.

You know, I was never happy with Tilda playing the white whitch...

Me either, honestly. She was okay, but not as good as I would like. Not beautiful enough. Besides, she was a horrible swordfighter.

Jadis was said to be ethereally beautiful in MN. She often caused people's breath to catch. Tilda doesn't do that. Plus, Uncle Andrew goes to the end of his days proclaiming she was the most beautiful woman he had ever met.

I always had a much prettier image of the white witch, and I didn't make her features so pale and muted. I mean, I gave her icy, alabaster skin, but her lips weren't bloodless, and her eyes weren't lifeless. She was no less sinister in my imaginings, but that was masked underneath a veneer of beauty.

Just goes to show that external beauty is just skin deep.

C.S. Lewis made it a point to note that her lips were as red as blood.

And the eye shadow stuff just made her look sickening and not even close to beautiful.

Yep yep, totally agree.

I used to be scared of the other white witch, because she had so much make-up that she looked completely unnatural.

I agree that the white witch's appearance was not taken far enough to give her the otherworldly lifeless beauty she examplifies in the books. I think her complete evil should have been represented better. She is more of a tempter character than an evil to be used in more than one movie (Although the appearance in Caspian is acceptable and condonable).

The appearance in Caspian was in the book, thus perfectly acceptable. In VDT it just kind of made me wish she'd die already.

Although... *thinks* allowing the White Witch to appear in green form makes me wonder if the movies will tie together more prominently the White Witch and the Lady of the Green Kirtle (Which Lewis kind of alludes to but never confirms)

They already made a jump by calling the White Witch Jadis (another thing the books never come out and say), so I think the reason they've kept the white witch in thus far is because they're planning on tying her into the Green Lady in SC.

eru

The books were pretty explicit that the White Witch was Jadis, I thought.

The books were clear that Jadis was the White witch. The books were also clear that Jadis/the White Witch was not the Lady of the Green Kirtle. As I kid I always wondered if she was the White Witch, but when I got older and reread the books I realized she wasn't. If they make her the Lady of the Green Kirtle I'll send in hate mail. That would be one step too far for me. *will need to rewatch the movie, doesn't remember her being in green... *

What about the character bios in the fronts of the books, which clearly stated that the Lady of the Green Kirtle was the White Witch?

What version are you reading? I've never seen a Narnia book with a character bio in it, and I have three different copies of the books. Also, all commentaries I've read on the books say that she is not the White Witch. *goes to fish out an excerpt *



Also, if Aslan killed her, why would we see her in SC? She is not described like Jadis at all, and her modes of operation and seduction are completely different.

It had a list of appearances, like "Aslan appeared in all the books." I thought that was written by C.S. Lewis himself, odd.

I have a very old copy, and two newer copies, and none of them have the bios. I would imagine that means Lewis did not write them, since I can’t see them cutting it if he did, and also, character bios are a new thing, like, within the last 20 years.

However, the dwarf reference to the Lady of the Green Kirtle, and the owl reference alone make it pretty evident that she is a different person, not to mention the other arguments of description and character changes.

Unfortunately, I could really see the movies making the White Witch and the Lady of the Green Kirtle into the same person.
If they do...
Argh.

Me too.

Hrm. Some of Lewis' other writings make it clear that he at least considered them being the same person. It's been too long since I've read the books...

@Jay: Mine have no bios, either

eru

*shrugs * I don't see them as the same person, and have found no reason too, but I've already given my arguments why, so I'll drop the subject.

Here we go, Jay. Here is my interpretation of how I think the White Whitch should have looked. Although I didn't get quite the look I wanted in her eyes...

Cool. She is quite beautiful.

Cool! Great picture miss Airianna! Who is she?

She is the White Witch from the Chronicles of Narnia.

I've got something of an essay in the works regarding my opinion of the VoDT film, but in the meantime regarding the discussion on this page of the thread, I'd like to present an excerpt from an interview with Douglas Gresham.




Not to say that Gresham is necessarily the utmost authority on all things Lewis, but he had more of a direct line than most. His answer seems to indicate to me that the Lady is not Jadis, Last Queen of Charn, brought into Narnia on the First Day through the misadventures of Polly, Diggory and Uncle Andrew. I feel that I remember reading where Lewis wrote that she was a witch rather of the same sort as Jadis (as far as her attitude and motivations went) but that they were entirely separate people, but I can't find it written anywhere in my collection, and without the direct reference I won't claim it as absolute truth.

At least this clears up the question of which edition had cast lists, as Sir Emeth remebers, but it looks like those were developed by the publisher, not by Jack himself.

That's really good.

Thanks, Jonathan.

@Roundelais: Thanks for clearing up the character list question.

The oldest owl said it, in the stone tower.

That's a good picture, Airi. One of the things I didn't like about the LWW is that they made her too evil and not beautiful enough

eru

Exactly. I mean, she is supposed to be evil, but part of what makes her so evil is her beauty.

Right. Because who's scared of an ugly witch?

eru

*raises hand* Not really.

*giggles * Honestly, I find the deceptive villains more terrifying. That's part of what I liked about the White Witch. She's not "obviously evil". She can deceive and manipulate. *shivers *

I think, though, that movie goers have to sometimes remember that we see things from a perspective that the hypothetical characters do not. One easily accepts, for instance, that Edmund might find the White Witch quite beautiful, despite personally thinking that she isn't really very nice looking. This perspective, of course, if affected by the fact that we know who, and what, Jadis is.

It's also interesting that, while Digory finds Jadis beautiful in The Magician's Nephew, Polly at least claims that she doesn't think Jadis is beautiful. Their own perspectives are affected by the enchantments and the sense of evil and ancient scope that pervade their location.

Finally, we know that beauty is, on some level, a matter of personal preference. I don't find the actress who played the White Witch particularly good looking, or even decent looking (since the Witch isn't particularly decent), but apparently the director felt she looked at least good enough for the part.

Jadis stole the Fruit...and gained everything she wanted, including beauty, and yet, did not like what she had gained.



Is it not possible that those who look at her face (pretending Narnia to be real) are affected by the good or evil in their heart? That those who are evil, or have some evil thought in them, see how she has gained all beauty, while those who are good, who are guided by Aslan, see how truly imperious, haughty, remorseless, and agonized she is, and therefore find no beauty?

Yes, Neil, I think you could make that point. And I'm okay with believing that point. Although, Lewis understood women well. So he would understand that a women that men would find beautiful, is not necessarily a woman that women find beautiful, whether because they dislike her, feel jealousy, or simply find different physical attributes appealing than men. Lewis made it clear that Polly not only did not like Jadis, but he also insinuated there was some jealousy and animosity felt by her because of how taken Digory was by her.

Also, Aunt Letty makes the observation that not only is Jadis beautiful, but she looks like a "shameful hussy". Implying a lot in those two words. Letty's heart would not be affected by Jadis. Also, more than one person comments on Jadis' appearance, or reacts to it. Even the cabby notices her appearance, and we know his heart is solid. He is not captivated like Digory and Andrew, but he does note it.

That is also a valid angle that I hadn't thought of.