Yeah, bad joke. Get it? Forge. Hammer out. Ahem.

Okay, so in a conversation with Aubrey Hansen about loglines, I brought up the idea of a logline thread on HW like the one I currently watch and participate in over on Christian Filmmakers. She told me that such a thread would be beyond awesome if I would agree to stick around and man it, so… I'll try.

What's a logline? Glad you asked. I just so happen to have written a lengthy blog series on this very topic. Here's a link to my recommended starting point: http://phantommoose.com/2011/08/09/what ... ne-anyway/

So. Now you know what a logline is. How do you post one? Like this:

TITLE: (the name of your book, movie, or opera goes here)
GENRE: (the genre goes here)
LOGLINE: (your logline goes here)

And then I promise to try to pop in here to pick loglines to pieces when/if people post them! (In a completely nice way, of course!)

Yay! The logline guru appeareth! Now I can get him to help me with my novel loglines as well!

I've been trying to hammer out one for my NaNo novel, if you can have a look sometime:

The Devil's Workshop
Supernatural Thriller
When the death of a forgotten friend remains unexplained, a police inspector suspects that demons may be at work in his small town, but can't get anyone else to listen to his theory.

Pick it to pieces, sir!

Y'all are lucky. Jordan's logline thread on CF is one of the most helpful threads ever; nearly all of my feature screenplays have gotten a workout over there. Now I can stop sneaking novel loglines in and just post 'em here!

*Needs to work on the logline for Faded*

Awesomesauce! Philli got me started on these, and the blog series is most helpful.

I've sent you my logline through PM, but I figured I'd post it here too... Whack away!

TITLE: Shattering the Dark
GENRE: Er, Hodgepodge? It's predominately historical fiction and spy fiction, with sci-fi and fantasy elements thrown into the blender.
LOGLINE: A reckless spy jeopardizes one of the most important operations ever involving his project, the 0#13102, when he is caught by his vehement enemy by disobeying explicit orders--and he might not survive to repair the damage.

TITLE: Well, Crissa was my original choice. However, the book not being completed yet, this title is tentative and will hopefully be replaced with something... a little more dynamic
GENRE: Predominately Fantasy. I geared it toward Youth & Young Adults.
LOGLINE: When that sneaky villain, Vadley, hatches a plot to take over the fantasy world Zoriah, Crissa is faced with the opportunity to stop him-- and ends up learning that no one can put a value on friendship.

(By the way, everybody, feel free to pop in with your own critique thoughts on loglines. Some may call me the guru, but I'm not the end-all on this subject by any means!)



Let's see… The first thing that jumps out at me is the term "forgotten friend". That might be a little too vague or strange. How exactly does one forget a friend? Drift apart, sure, but forget… Nope.

"Remains unexplained" indicates a long passage of time before something actually happens. Is that your intention?

"A police inspector" doesn't tell us anything about him beyond his occupation. Is he wimpy? The manliest guy alive? Purple? The world's worst driver?

"Can't get anyone else to listen…" Is the whole point of the story that he needs to find someone to listen? Or is the point that he needs to track down the murderer? If it's the latter, you'll have better luck stressing that aspect. Promise us the premise! (And yeah, my critique in here is going to be somewhat screenwriting influenced, but that's what you get for listening to a screenwriter!)

Don't worry, Jordan. They don't have any trouble listening to a screenwriter. They let me babble all the time!

Yeah, genre is a toughie. Personally, I like to stick with simple things about the type of story… Romance, thriller, etc. Setting can be added to those to get things like spy thriller, fantasy romance, etc.

Anyway…

You don't need to name the project that has been jeopardized. Just say "project" and we'll get it for this purpose.

When I read through this one, it makes me think that surviving to repair the damage is the main thrust of the story. You might want to rearrange the logline to make that the focus. Something like:

When a reckless spy disobeys explicit orders and jeopardizes one of the most important operations ever involving his project, he is caught by his vehement enemy and might not survive to repair the damage.

Otherwise, good work on giving us adjectives for each character mentioned! You've got a pretty compelling logline here.

Let's start here… A fundamental rule of loglines is that you never name anybody. You describe them while leaving them anonymous.

Your villain has an adjective, so that's good and you can leave off the name.

Just saying "fantasy world" will take care of Zoriah, though you might want to just say world.

Crissa, however… Who is this? What kind of person? Boy? Girl? Weird genderless alien being? And then also find an adjective that tells us what this person is like. Risk-loving, egg-shaped, grumpy.

Also, don't put your moral in the logline. Tell us the story's hook (what makes us want to read this) and let us think about what might be learned from such a story.

* chuckles * Philli helped a lot with this one.

Hmmm... The main focus of the story is his recklessness leading him to disobey direct orders. The other stuff plays into that. Any helps?

Does the disobedience happen at the beginning, middle, or end? Is it the climax? Is it the inciting incident?

You want to show how the inciting incident pushes the hero into the middle of the story (the premise), and then give just enough information about the climax to make your reader extrapolate possible endings.

It's the inciting incident.

So if I'm following this correctly, the inciting incident is the disobedience, but you're going to play with the theme of the hero's recklessness throughout the story.

As I said before, a logline is meant to tease on the climax by giving away the inciting incident.

Thanks for critiquing. I'm definitely going to work on this.

Thank you so much, Jordan! Here's my next try:

The Devil’s Workshop
Supernatural Thriller
When the death of an estranged friend goes unsolved, a phlegmatic police inspector suspects that demons may be at work in his small town, but when no one will listen to his theory he must risk everything to stand alone against the evil.

Yes, exactly.

Hmm... Something like this?

TITLE: Shattering the Dark
GENRE: Hodgepodge
LOGLINE: When a reckless spy disobeys explicit orders and jeopardizes one of the most important operations ever involving his project, he is caught by his vehement enemy.

Define "everything". How everything? Job? Status? Wife? Kids? Life?

I had to use my dictionary on "phlegmatic". Maybe you'd want to pick a better-known synonym.

And…? You have a great beginning and a decent middle (see below), but then we have the ending. He's caught. And then what? Does he try to escape? You might try using a "must" in there… "…he must escape from his vehement enemy…" and then something compelling there that I'd need more story details to fill in. Show us the stakes. What bad thing will happen if everything keeps going wrong?

As to the middle, you can probably trim down "one of the most important operations ever" to "an important operation". You might not even need the two words about his project.

Hmmm... Let's try this.

The Masked Bird
Historical/Fantasy Fiction, Robin Hood
Neglected and hurt by her father and having discovered the his mistreatment of the peasants, the Earl of Nottingham's daughter joins Robin Hood's band to fight against injustice, but soon finds herself sidetracked by her own desire for revenge.

I know you said in another critique not to include names, but with my story part of the appeal is that it's a twist on an already known story.

All righty. How's this?

TITLE: Shattering the Dark
GENRE: Hodgepodge
LOGLINE: When a reckless spy disobeys explicit orders and jeopardizes a crucial operation, he is caught by his vehement enemy and must conquer his impetuosity to survive.

Famous figures are an exception to the no-name rule.

Next and maybe last try:

The Devil’s Workshop
Supernatural Thriller
When the death of an estranged friend goes unsolved, a stoic police inspector suspects that demons may be at work in his small town, but when no one will listen to his theory he must risk his job, his marriage, and even his life to stand alone against the evil.

Any more suggestions, sir?

Aubrey is right.

Okay, the biggest issue I'm seeing is that your opening clause is very wordy. Can you get all that into a smaller space? If I were doing it, I'd try something like, "After discovering her neglectful father's mistreatment of his subjects…"

Abusive is a stronger adjective to use in place of neglectful in light of the revenge wish, but I'm not totally sure how appropriate it is to the story.

It'd be nice if you could give the daughter her own adjective, too.

That's pretty good! I'm not coming up with anything to change. Keep it and use it to write the back copy!

It's working for me. I must admit that because it's not in one of my favorite genres, I'm having a difficult time deciding if it's not clicking with me because the logline needs work or just because I don't generally read supernatural thrillers…

Thank you, sir!

*nods* That makes sense. I don't generally read them either. Remind me why I'm writing one again...?

Anyway, thank you so much for your help! I'll go with that for now. You're awesome to help us out with these.

Okay! Regarding abusive: I'm actually not quite sure. It falls somewhere in the middle of neglectful and abusive.

The Masked Bird
Historical/Fantasy Fiction, Robin Hood
Incensed by her discovery of her neglectful father's mistreatment of the peasants, the Earl of Nottingham's proud daughter joins Robin Hood's band to fight against injustice, but soon finds herself sidetracked by her own desire for revenge.

Still too wordy?

Actually, that one works very well, I think. Now I want to read this thing!

*grins* Thank you.

Ah! So this was the side I was supposed to put my fantasy loglines on.

I don't think it matters much, Airianna. Other people had fantasy loglines on HWSF, too.

Well good. I didn't even know the one over here existed.

Try one.

Some stories do. That's when you find your unique angle on the concept and squish it in there. And that's the fun part!

You can do it!

(Where's a logline advocate with cheerleader-fu? Aubrey, get in here!)

I'm not Aubrey, but I'll try...

Go E, go! Go E, go! You would write an awesome logline and you know it! Try it! Try it! Your writing is awesome and your logline will be too, so DO IT!

*sits in thread to wait for E's logline*

*comes in coaxingly * Now E, I have total faith in your ability to write a good logline. And Jordan is a very good and kind teacher. I recently did one for the first book in my trilogy, and I was very pleased with the end result. I think you could create a solid logline. Just look at the pulse of your story and weave it all together. If you have to, start out with a paragraph. From there, condense it down to two sentences, and whittle it down to one.

*holds E's hand and gently draws her into the thread *

You can do it, E!

Cheerleader-fu?

Now, Lady E, here's the thing. First, like books, the first "draft" of your logline doesn't have to be perfect. It's okay if your first logline is too long or too cliche or too whatever - that's what this thread is for. You post it, get some opinions on it (because it might not be as cliche as you think!), and we fix it together. No problem. That's why Malfhok is here - we need to keep him busy.

Second, the primary goal of a logline is to sell your book. Nothing else matters if you can condense your story into a sentence in a way that gets people to want to read it. So ask yourself - why did you want to write the book? What about it excites you? What about it do you feel is unique? Make a list and see if that gives you any ideas. Maybe you need to put the focus on the subplots. That's okay. Just write some sentences and see what you get!

Airianna also has a good suggestion - you can start with a longer summary and slowly chop off the nonessential bits (or find ways to condense the same information into fewer words). Generally speaking it's easier to cut, cut, cut rather than add words, so as my screenwriting mentor would say... Write it long, write it strong, and chop it to bits in editing.

I am really liking the idea of a son and father having to work out their differences to prevent a war. There's amazing drama in that and it's a good twist.

I also really like the idea that the son is the villain. That's even deeper drama and is also a unique spin on the whole evil usurper plot.

Any way you could get both of those elements in the same logline?

What can I say? Aubrey's covered it!

All right, my turn now!

I need y'all's help with the logline for Peter's Angel, my "fantasy epic." I actually already have a logline for this book - but it's only 6 words. I think I need to expand it to be more poetic and slightly more detailed for marketing purposes.

My 6-word logline is "A vassal restores his own overlord." Writing that logline was extremely helpful because it distilled my 100k-words-or-more-we're-not-sure-yet plot into the barest, basest core. Peter, the heir to a fief, finds the long-lost prince of the motherland and attempts to restore him. That's it. Everything in the massive novel comes down to that. Also, that summary conveys my irony - a prince restoring another prince, specifically his own overlord. That's my unique twist on the typical "long-lost prince" scenario.

So while I've figured out the core of my novel, I think I need to phrase it in a slightly more elegant fashion for marketing purposes. But the problem is, as soon as I start including more details than the absolute minimum, I run into the issue of deciding WHICH details to include!

Hence, I need some assistance.

I think I should probably keep the same framework of my Hemingway and just fluff out the words. Make Peter the subject of the sentence, but describe him a little better. The action of the sentence would be something along the lines of "discovers the long-lost heir of the motherland and attempts to restore" him. Ideally I would hint at the major threat of the novel - the powerful motherland that wants the heir dead.

Thoughts? Jordan, this is the book for which I showed you the 7-page synopsis awhile back, if that helps.

I did? I must be picking up something from your awesomeness.

Aubrey, all your rambling on what to put into your logline for Peter's Angel really answers your own question, I think! Take this:



And logline-ify it.

That's what I thought, but see, I wanted a second opinion. Since thou has officially sanctioned that as a good route to go, I shall start there and get back to you. Thanks!