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 Post subject: Jesus Character
PostPosted: November 7th, 2013, 7:09 pm 
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Over the course of time, many readers, students, apologetics, search for the Jesus character of a story. This character is usually winsome, wise beyond their years, miraculous in some ways, authoritative, anti-mainstream, powerful, kind, safe, able to relate to others in extraordinary ways.

Usually the Jesus character dies or has a rite of passage scene. Usually they have disciple characters. They usually share intriguing stories. The Jesus character has a deeper knowledge of history than any of his own generation. This central figure is quick, illusive, sharp and charismatic; enjoys townspeople and villagers - then retreats to mountainsides alone.

There are cliches to the Jesus characters in modern tales. The "Jesus" usually is all-too-powerful or flawless. The "Jesus" person follows age old heresies - i.e. human only, not God or divine only, not genuinely human. These "jesuses" heal everybody the same way. Miracles are carbon-copy-based.

My Question - Do you write Jesus characters and how do you write them plus, how do you avoid a good "Jesus" cliche?

Thinking again...

VarTalman


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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: November 8th, 2013, 3:05 pm 
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Could you give us an example or two of the kind of Jesus character you are talking about?

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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 12th, 2016, 12:58 am 
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Jesus examples from Tolkien:

Aragorn: king unwanted powerful warrior, conqueror crowned

Gandalf: grey-to-white transfiguration, dead and alive again... sent.

"cliche" Jesus types:

hippie Birkenstock Jesus, rolling stone Jesus, soothsayer Jesus, carpenter, or
Lion

Creative Jesus characters (thinking outside the box...):

Human Torch Jesus, Tree Jesus, hideous Jesus, Jesus the cobbler


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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 12th, 2016, 4:16 pm 
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From off the top of my head (does anyone get ideas from the bottom of their head???), here goes...

Should we have non-Jesus "Jesus" characters?

We should avoid characters that become the source of salvation in of themselves. Such is the nature of an idol. The Bible calls us to be imitators of our Savior, but we are not the Savior. If you want the rebirth kind of thing, I suppose that you could write a character that has an character changing experience more akin to being saved and reborn in Christ.

Beware the Neitzche's supermen.

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Last edited by DoodleWriter on May 18th, 2016, 7:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 12th, 2016, 10:58 pm 
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This topic figured big into my literature worldview class in high school.

There is only one story worth telling, and that is the one given to us by the Lord. Everything we make can only be in the image of the Bible, or in perversion of the Bible. In the same way, Jesus will always be a model for a character somewhere or another. Because of that, most main characters (and several secondary or side characters) fit into one of seven "Jesus" roles.

The Man Himself---The Son of God, as He appears in the gospels. (The Passion of the Christ)
The Type of Christ---A character who goes through a death (possibly symbolic) or rite of passage to save their people and point the way to Jesus. (Jonah, Aslan, Frodo, Aragorn)
The Anti-Jesus---A character so evil that their dark parallel of Jesus pushes us toward the real thing. (Dracula)
The Freedom Bringer---A character given Christ-like symbolism to emphasize the freedom he brings to his people. (Braveheart)
The Message Bringer---A character that uses Christ-like symbolism to bring a new message to the people of their time. (Luke Skywalker)
The Scarecrow Messiah---A Jesus, usually in person, specifically designed to disprove or mock the real thing.
The Mask of Jesus---A character with Jesus symbolism who passes the mantel on to the "next savior". (Superman Returns, The Mask of Zorro)

The first three are characters that will point toward the Lord in their representation. The fourth can go one way or another, but the last three are all designed to discredit the Bible and the true Son of God, and either make Him look laughable, or to superimpose the writer's own worldview onto God Himself.

The fact of the matter is that we can't avoid using Jesus type characters. They're going to show up whether or not we mean to put them there. Just about every story can be found to have one of the above types. Any type can be written well or poorly.

I think the secret to writing a "Man Himself" without it becoming cheesy or heretical is the same way as writing your best friend into your story. You have to be spending more time with Him, in His Word and in prayer, than you do with your plots, music, and stories and books. Even a well-written type of Christ isn't Jesus Himself, and can be something that the enemy uses to distract you from time with the Lord.

The nice thing is, when you really spend time with Him, you don't have to worry about how to write well---you don't have to worry about whether you write at all---because He'll give you what you need to draw closer to Him and to point others in the same direction, in the way He desires, rather than the way we do.

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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 14th, 2016, 3:09 am 
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Why can the fourth one go either way, but the last three cannot?


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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 14th, 2016, 4:39 pm 
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I'm going to try and make a guess at why.

The Message Bringer: A new message is not the true message of Christ and is false so will influence people towards that message.

The Scarecrow Messiah: This one is plain. Mocking Christ is not likely to draw people to him.

The Mask of Jesus: I'm not so certain on this one. Probably because this is more of a replacement for Christ than a real representation of Christ.

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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 16th, 2016, 9:12 am 
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The Message Bringer specifically has Messianic symbolism so that his message will be equal in importance to Christ's. The Freedom Bringer might truly be freeing his people from the chains of sin, or he might be freeing them from having to follow the Bible, so his story can be good or bad based on what the author presents as right and wrong.

The Scarecrow Messiah is based on the strawman argument in logic fallacy. It is when someone purposely makes their opponent look weak, fragile, and hollow for the sake of proving how strong they are by comparison.

The Mask of Jesus is based on the philosophy of several new age religions that say Jesus was a good moral teacher who had important things to teach the people of His time, but that was two thousand years ago, and there are new things to be taught now, which is why we have Buddha, Joseph Smith, Gandhi, and other modern teachers. The idea of The Mask of Jesus is that Jesus was one member of a long, humanitarian relay race, but His time is done, and He passes the mantel on to another savior. They can be a variation on The Message Bringer or The Freedom Bringer, but the story never draws back to the real Jesus. The savior then passes the mantel on to a a new savior for a new time.

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Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: March 17th, 2016, 3:41 pm 
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Ah, I understand better now. Thanks for expounding, Kitra.

Lady Anna Briar wrote:
The Message Bringer: A new message is not the true message of Christ and is false so will influence people towards that message.
Yes, this in particular was what I was trying to figure out. But I think it makes sense that someone trying to bring a change, freedom, or in other words new life, to people is fundamentally different from someone trying to bring a new message, which as you say must be false because it is not the message of the true Christ.


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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: April 21st, 2016, 12:11 am 
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I would strongly disagree that the concept of a Mask of Jesus character necessarily ties into the ideas of Eastern religions and that He was simply a moral teacher, especially if the content of the character is not spiritual. As with all archetypes, they can be mixed and matched fairly easily, so adding some others, like the Strawman version, would definitely do that.

It is entirely possible I think, to have a Mask character point towards Jesus, especially with what the symbolism represents. To have a mask be passed on is to carry a legacy and a purpose. In a way, all Christians are mask-wearers of Christ.

But I suppose now looking back, that this referred just to characters molded after Jesus, not all Mask characters. :blush:

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 Post subject: Re: Jesus Character
PostPosted: April 23rd, 2016, 8:20 pm 
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Yeah, it depends on how important the character is to the people. The idea is that there always has to be a Zorro, but in Peretti's Prophet, there is a literal passing on of the coat, but it's to keep fighting the fight, not to be a new savior to the people.

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You can't spell grin without ̶gRIN
Words are my ̶bread and ̶butter.
http://unshakablegirl.com/
http://www.ravelry.com/designers/kitra-skene

Haud Retene Haud Reverte

All resemblance to persons, people, friends, relatives, quotes, cultures, artificial intelligences, inside jokes, pets, unclaimed personalities, sentient objects, extra-terrestrials, inter-terrestrials, and draperies living, dead, undead, or comatose in any of my work are purely coincidental, incidental, circumstantial, inadvertent, unplanned, unforeseen, and unintentional. There's seriously no way I was referring to you. Honest.

The story so far:
Birthright: Eleventh chapter pending. 28280 words.
Heritage: First chapter drafted.
Legacy: Character and plot development stage.
Get a feel for the land. Visit Lor-Amar today!

Other novels on the brain:
Quicksilver
Shen'oh Story
Crusoe's Star
War Blazer
Seven Arts Story
The Queen's Knave
Polarians
Exile Realms
All Librarians Are Secret Agents


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