This is the Beginning

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** August 10th, 2013, 3:25 am

Alright,

Should we be loyal to Holy Worlds?
Should we be devoted to Holy Worlds?
Should we be proud of Holy Worlds?
Should we be known as Holy Worlders?
Should we defend and stand for Holy Worlds?

If Holy Worlds is a forum, a blog, a title, an organization, then the answer is simply,
No.

As firmly as I believe this I know that this is NOT what Holy Worlds is.

Holy Worlds is not an organization, it is an organism. It is not even a specific group of people; people come and go, and Holy Worlds is the same; even if everyone left Holy Worlds would be the same.

Holy Worlds is the Purpose that these people are a part of, the reason why they are here, and it is what we should be loyal to.

This is why you are here, on this forum, reading my post:

Quote:

Our Vision
Holy Worlds is here to encourage, equip, train,
challenge, and facilitate quality and effective use of niche media genres
for the glory of God and the furtherance of Christian culture.

This is our prime, overriding purpose, and this is the reason that we exist. Everything we do should either come from this, or move towards this. We facilitate and help other things outside of this purpose via a trickle effect, but not directly. For example, we help people be respectful to their parents, but we do that by fulfilling our prime objective here. Our thrust is to fulfill our mission, that mission is there to glorify God in all of life.

Encourage
Holy Worlds is a safe environment. It does not tear people down no matter what the circumstances. It always works to behave in a mature, positive way, even when dealing with hot, sticky, controversial issues, which we do not shy from. We work together collaboratively, without attacking or seeking to defeat another person's point of view. We recognize that immorality is different from incorrectness.

Equip
Holy Worlds is a resourceful community. We realize that we are not the only sources of information or wisdom for the accomplishment of our goal. We learn always, and we take what we learn from third party resources and bring them here to share them. People can come here to learn from the wisdom of the ages and the world, without having to go through the labor of finding it all themselves. We work together to learn together from others.

Train
Holy Worlds is a community that does not only grow by peer to peer encouragement, but also by mentorship training. We recognize that every single one of us has many things that they can teach and train everyone else in. We respect each person as someone with unique, individual strengths and knowledge, and we submit ourselves to each other in that respect, seeking to learn from each other in a partnership of learning.

Challenge
Holy Worlds is a community that does not let people sit idle on their dreams. It pushes people to step out and put forth the effort and diligence required to fulfill their own desires. It does this by example, by accountability among friends, by encouragement, by equipping, by training, and by facilitation. We do not encourage people to relax, but rather to do their absolute best for the glory of God, and through His strength.

Facilitate
Holy Worlds provides the means to help its members do their work better, to help them accomplish the goal of Holy Worlds. It works to make the production of quality and effective godly media more accessible for newcomers to the field of media creation. Our focus on facilitation is to help break new ground: in the bringing up of new authors, filmmakers, artists, and etcetera, as well as in the taking advantage of new forms and strategies of media production. We make collaboration, perfection, and production easier and thus more accessible for amateurs.

Promote Quality
Holy Worlds promotes and works towards media that is not only godly, but quality. We are not here to make it easier for sub-par creations be published, but to make sub-par creations good enough to be publishable. We encourage, but do not condone. We look for the potential in people and help them bring that out, without discouraging them from trying at all. We work to keep people going towards their goal, and we work with people where they are.

Effectiveness
Holy Worlds sees that everything we do has an impact and influence. Some things more than others. We work to make sure that the media produced in coordination with and with the help of Holy Worlds is as effective as possible, for the end in the mind of the producer. Not everyone has the same vision, goal, and motive in making media, and we recognize that. We do not impose our own priorities for impact on those of the people we work with: we just help them fulfill their own calling as well as they can.

Using niche media genres
Holy Worlds reaches out to the people and genres that are not commonly reached. We are a geek culture, and we enjoy the strange and the bizarre. We recognize that although there is a need in every genre for the glory of God to shine, we are called to the 'forgotten genres.' We see that the church has completely written off many of these genres, due to a lack of godly examples and a lack of understanding about what makes up these genres. We are here to reclaim the strengths of these genres for the glory of God, instead of shying away from the difficulties associated with them.

Glorifying God
Holy Worlds is a Christian community, dedicated to God. We are here to become more like Christ. What we do, we do to bring Him pleasure. We recognize that our creative gifts are directly from God, and that to use them without His strength, even if done in His name, is counter-productive. We want to show that God is interested in entertainment and pleasure as well as in teaching and training. We want to make the food of entertainment bring glory to God, even if it doesn't have the path to salvation written out in it.

Furthering Christian culture
Holy Worlds is made of culture. That is its muscle, bones, mind, and heart. This culture is built off of godly interaction. We recognize that the way we go about accomplishing an end is just as important as the end itself. And that if we are to impact our world for God through our writing, that writing needs to flow out of a heart and community that is itself impacting the world for God. We are here to behave in a Christian, mature manner to each other.

Paul said, "...be followers of me, as I am of Christ..."
I even have this in my signature.

This is what the name Mimetes means:
Follower.

Mimetes is our name.

As Holy Worlds (meaning the Vision which I quoted) follows Christ, we must follow it.

If there is a problem on Holy Worlds, do not be a part of the problem. When there are problems that is when we snap out of our distractions and self-pity and work harder.

And when everything is going "perfectly" that is when we snap out of our routines and self-congratulation and work harder.
"Do Hard Things."

We must be loyal to Christ in diligently fulfilling what we have set out to do in his name.

We must be devoted to Christ in sacrificially serving his cause.

We must be proud of Christ in seeking to glorify his name.

We must be known as followers of Christ in being followers of his work.

We must defend and stand for Christ's work; the enemy knows us, and will not sleep.

Whether or not you may have noticed, I have never been on Holy Worlds very consistently, and recently I have been gone for long periods.

This was not because I was busy with other projects. I was busy with other projects, but all of them could have, and should have, involved my friends on Holy Worlds. Thank you for being here!

I am not apologizing, there is no excuse for it: it was neglectful. So I am asking your forgiveness, and I want you to know that I am back, and will be more involved.

One of the things I have been working on is Pinterest; I have boards about various aspects of Iniel which I will link to from my sub-forum. I am also recording the sound for this stop action short video I am making:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/events/c8kks00f17r7j66omf08b329h1s

Your servant in the work of Christ,
Patrick, Tsahraf.

Aragorn · **Joined:** September 23rd, 2010, 3:42 pm **Posts:** 9085

Very thought-provoking, Patrick. I'm glad you'll be around more.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** August 14th, 2013, 1:51 am

Thank you Jonathan! I have noticed how you post everywhere, even if you do not say much. Thank you for helping so much to encourage people!

RunningWolf · **Posted:** August 14th, 2013, 9:27 am

I agree with Jonathan, it'll be good to see you around more Patrick! And I also agree that Jonathan is a great encouragement throughout HW.

Cain · **Joined:** September 4th, 2012, 9:21 am **Posts:** 1755

I agree with both Lycanis and Jonathan. It'll be nice to see you around more.

Lady Carliss · **Joined:** November 17th, 2010, 5:28 pm **Posts:** 136

Bravo! An excellent reminder of what Holy Worlds is!

Aragorn · **Joined:** September 23rd, 2010, 3:42 pm **Posts:** 9085

Thanks, Patrick and Jeremiah.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** August 17th, 2013, 1:00 pm

Thank you Jeremiah, Lady Renna, and Lady Carliss!
It is interesting how this has changed me in some ways: I have gotten a taste of my Otherworld that I have not had for a long time, then I started listening to music more again, and began to have detailed, vivid scenes like I used to have. The main thing is that I have been writing more, regardless of whether it is about my writing.

Kessie · **Posted:** August 17th, 2013, 4:25 pm

Nice to know the mission statement! Maybe it should be in the little agreement thingy as you're signing up? This is the first I've seen of any such thing, and I've been here three whole days. :-)

Airianna Valenshia · **Posted:** August 17th, 2013, 8:35 pm

Nice to see you post, Patrick.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** August 28th, 2013, 3:44 pm

Kessie wrote:

Nice to know the mission statement! Maybe it should be in the little agreement thingy as you're signing up? This is the first I've seen of any such thing, and I've been here three whole days. :-)

Definitely! I think it is a good idea to at least direct new members to the Vision at some point in the process, so they can see what Holy Worlds is.

Airianna Valenshia wrote:

Nice to see you post, Patrick.

Thank you Lady Airi! It is good to post.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** September 1st, 2013, 10:02 am

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

But, we need to take this with humility and dignity. We are not the only Christian community our there, we are not the best Christian community out there.

We know that when we glorify a part of God's Word, there is no point when we glorify that part "too much," or any point when by glorifying it we show disrespect to any other part of God's Word, because God's Word is in perfect agreement with itself.

In the same way, by glorifying the part of Christ's work that is Holy Worlds, we show humility before God, and the dignity of working in his name. There is no point when we glorify Christ's work "too much," or any point when by glorifying it we show any disrespect to any other work of Christ.

In not glorifying the cause of Christ in Holy Worlds we would belittle the cause of Christ in every attempt to serve him. If one of the members suffer, all the members suffer with it.

We are not the only Christian Fantasy writers (or writer helpers), nor are we the best ones; but if in any way we fall short, we fall short of being Holy Worlders; Holy Worlds does not fall short.

Technically speaking though, I do think Holy Worlds is one of a kind, and the best of its kind.

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

I didn't intend to come down too hard on you Patrick.

You did come down too hard Brendan.

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

I think it's important for us to remember that our loyalty to Christ and our loyalty to Holy Worlds are not one and the same thing. Holy Worlds could fall.

The point of my post is that this would be true, if Holy Worlds was a forum, an organization, a title. The point of my post is that Holy Worlds is not; it never was, and it never could be.

The forum, the blog, the organization, all take their name from the Vision. A person who calls himself a "Holy Worlder" takes this name from the commitment I quoted. This is what we should always remember.

Loyalty to Christ and loyalty to Holy Worlds is the same in this: the Vision is the definition of Holy Worlds, and the Vision is "Loyalty to Christ." Holy Worlds is the Vision of being loyal to Christ in a specific area: and there is no area where we should not be loyal to Christ.

If we do not follow Christ by following Holy Worlds in every way, then we should not follow Holy Worlds at all. If we should follow it in any way, it is because by following it we follow Christ, and should we ever hang back in that?

23 And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;
24 Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ.
Colossians 3

Look at the Vision. Will that fall? Doing what is right cannot fail.

Only we can fail Holy Worlds. This is what you were referring to. Looking at the forum, the organization, the title, as if that was Holy Worlds, you said we should not follow it.

In order to say we can follow Holy Worlds instead of following God, we must already be thinking of Holy Worlds as separate from Christ's work, in which case we have already lost it. Look at the Vision: does that Vision, that commitment to serve Christ, get “thrown in”? No.

As niche media workers, it is our responsibility to dedicate our work to Christ, and Holy Worlds is the fulfillment of that responsibility.

Holy Worlds is the Vision "We will follow Christ in this also."

Quote:

Our thrust is to fulfill our mission, that mission is there to glorify God in all of life.

That can only fail when it fails to follow Christ.

Legatus Christo · **Joined:** June 10th, 2013, 1:52 pm **Posts:** 112

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

Alright, let me get what you're saying,....

Quote:

You did come down too hard Brendan.

Not my intended motive.

That was however the result. Its strength even when I first joined was the fact its members cared and acted like it. What happened? This whole mess comes down to the simple matter of forgiveness. Much has been forgiven us as Christians therefore we must forgive much (Matthew 18:21-35). A lot has happened but this is the beginning only if we allow it to be. God's name isnt I was it is I AM

Aratrea · **Posted:** September 3rd, 2013, 1:01 pm

If I may jump into the conversation for a moment here, there's a huge difference between the intended vision of a group, and how the group pursues (or fails to pursue) that vision. I agree that the vision of HW is a noble one. But are we truly following that vision? I believe that we are trying--but the explosions that have occurred within the 'New Admin' thread and others show that we have not successfully followed after that vision.

Loyalty to Christ is a great vision that we must always pursue. But if a community drifts away from that vision and loses it, then it may be best for the community to die because it's lost its true vision. Christ talks about this in Revelation 2 with the Ephesians. And if Christ was willing to remove a whole congregation because they had lost their first love, how much more a community, if they lost their true vision?

This is not to say that HW necessarily needs to die. But that we need to realize that we have serious problems going around here. And we need to either solve them, or give up the community. And I don't want to have to do the latter.

But we can't set up HW as an idol by trying to follow "it." I'm not even sure what "it" is. We need to follow the Scriptures and Christ. HW will always be imperfect because, well, it's made up of a lot of sinful human beings, myself included. We need to see past the imperfections toward our vision and Christ. But we can't content ourselves with merely following HW. We need to follow the perfect image of Christ.

Mistress Kidh · **Posted:** September 3rd, 2013, 2:44 pm

Aratrea wrote:

If I may jump into the conversation for a moment here, there's a huge difference between the intended vision of a group, and how the group pursues (or fails to pursue) that vision. I agree that the vision of HW is a noble one. But are we truly following that vision? I believe that we are trying--but the explosions that have occurred within the 'New Admin' thread and others show that we have not successfully followed after that vision.

Loyalty to Christ is a great vision that we must always pursue. But if a community drifts away from that vision and loses it, then it may be best for the community to die because it's lost its true vision. Christ talks about this in Revelation 2 with the Ephesians. And if Christ was willing to remove a whole congregation because they had lost their first love, how much more a community, if they lost their true vision?

This is not to say that HW necessarily needs to die. But that we need to realize that we have serious problems going around here. And we need to either solve them, or give up the community. And I don't want to have to do the latter.

But we can't set up HW as an idol by trying to follow "it." I'm not even sure what "it" is. We need to follow the Scriptures and Christ. HW will always be imperfect because, well, it's made up of a lot of sinful human beings, myself included. We need to see past the imperfections toward our vision and Christ. But we can't content ourselves with merely following HW. We need to follow the perfect image of Christ.

I agree with you.

Elijah McGowan · **Posted:** September 3rd, 2013, 3:42 pm

"Holy Worlds is the Purpose that these people are a part of, the reason why they are here, and it is what we should be loyal to."

The purpose we are a part of is the glorification of God and enjoying Him through Christ forever as his church. That is not Holy Worlds. Holy Worlds, like Brendan said, is a man-made attempt at applying scripture, not scripture, not Christ.

All this HTML and BBCode and PHP and text files and JPGs hosted on some BlueHost server in Utah will pass away, will be forgotten, will be discarded, will end like all things do.

People don't end. Cherish and love them. You can never show too much grace and mercy.

The Word of God endures forever. Honor it. Seek wisdom there.

Christ reigns eternal. The trinity will not pass away.

These three things matter. The purpose people are here for is not Holy Worlds, and they are not here to serve Holy Worlds. Holy Worlds exists to facilitate the people, bearing God's image. As an admin of my own forum, I know that a website a community does not make. It's the people. If the people left, Holy Worlds would be dead. The end. The people will last forever, and Holy Worlds will end someday.

Don't confuse this lowly creation with your creator.

I'm really curious as to how Patrick defines his terms here, because like Brendan, I'm afraid he's just publicly stated some serious heresy.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** September 9th, 2013, 12:05 am

I am not sorry for how long it has taken to answer this. Words this extreme sometimes can not be answered quickly, however quickly they are said. I have prayed, and thought, how I should respond. And what has happened is unacceptable.

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

you really need to clarify your statements.

I may need to, I often need to still. But nothing in what I have said justifies your accusations.

Sir Inesdar Ternis wrote:

Are you actually equating Holy Worlds with Holy Scriptures? Tell me if I misread your argument, but you seem to be saying is that we should submit to HW, as we do to scriptures. Honestly, be careful about comparing a fallible human website to the infallible word of God.

This was uncalled for. "Glorifying the cause of Christ in Holy Worlds" is not equating a website with God's word. You spoke of a "fallible, human website," as if I believed Holy Worlds was merely a forum, a blog, a title, or an organization. You ignored me when I said:

"this is NOT what Holy Worlds is."

Holy Worlds is a commitment, a goal, a purpose, a vision, a desire, to glorify God.

You can speak of the website as "Holy Worlds," you may speak of the organization as "Holy Worlds," because these things are committed to the Purpose that is Holy Worlds; that is completely legitimate. When you say we should be humble about our achievements and give all the glory to God, what you say is true.

But when I said that Holy Worlds is the Purpose to glorify God, and that it is this Purpose which makes us Holy Worlders, for you to suggest that I am speaking of a website, and then to say that I am making it equal with God's Word, is pointless cutting people down.

Thank you for admitting doubt, though your insinuations can not be excused as misunderstandings.

Mr. Eli, let me remind you that I defined my terms in the first words of my first post.

I said, Holy Worlds is not a website, it is a commitment to glorify God. This is not making anything equal to God’s Word, or making anything equal to God himself.

What you said about the people being the heart of Holy Worlds is true. If the people abandoned the Vision, it would still be good, but it would be a good deed abandoned. The people, whether they are the old hands or a completely new crew, are the soul of Holy Worlds because they are the ones who have made the commitment which is Holy Worlds.

But you have done me wrong, in that you said these things as if you were contradicting me, as if I was saying that the “HTML and BBCode and PHP and text files and JPGs hosted on some BlueHost server in Utah” was more important than the people. I have said nothing like what you implied.

When I said that if everyone left, Holy Worlds would be the same, I would like to clarify this: if an entirely new group of people joined to replace the people that left, these new people would be the soul of Holy Worlds; and Holy Worlds would be the same unifying Vision and Purpose that it was before.

Dr. W. Eli McGowan wrote:

Don't confuse this lowly creation with your creator.

This is unacceptable. To say, "I am a Holy Worlder because I commit myself to glorify God in my writing" is not treating a website as God!

There were good responses at first, which is typical of Holy Worlds, to the glory of God; but these insinuations are a great shock. When I said, “Holy Worlds is the Vision "We will follow Christ in this also." “ I did not expect to be treated like this. Again, this is unacceptable.

Eli and Brendan, your words have been deeply hurtful and thoughtless. If you continue in this behavior I will lock this topic until further notice. If you want to discuss these points further, please pm me.
This topic was meant to remember the glorifying of God as the center and meaning of Holy Worlds.

BushMaid · **Posted:** September 9th, 2013, 12:26 am

Patrick, Brendan and Eli's statements were not to hurt or offend just as your statement wasn't to elevate HW to the same plain as God's Word. A lot of your post did come across as though it were glorifying the forum too much, and Brendan and Eli's posts were addressing that, though they could have done so less offensively. All of you were speaking from a heart that wishes to serve and honour God above all else, and from a heart that defends what you care about. You needn't be offended at those purposes, so don't allow yourself to become bitter and hurt over it.

See the meaning for what it truly is.

Aratrea · **Posted:** September 9th, 2013, 6:45 am

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes wrote:

Holy Worlds is a commitment, a goal, a purpose, a vision, a desire, to glorify God.

But when I said that Holy Worlds is the Purpose to glorify God, and that it is this Purpose which makes us Holy Worlders, for you to suggest that I am speaking of a website, and then to say that I am making it equal with God's Word, is pointless cutting people down.

Thanks for clarifying your position, Tsahraf.

I don't believe that Eli and Brendan were purposefully trying to cut you down. Honestly, I think that most people, when they hear the words "Holy Worlds" will automatically think of the forum and the website. I personally have never seen it used to describe a vision before. I understand that you defined your terms in the previous post, but it hadn't been as clear as it is now, since, I, at least, was still locked-in to my normal perception of it as a website rather than a goal. With the clarification, the post makes a lot more sense. I apologize if my previous post hurt you in any way since I was misinterpreting the meaning of your post.

Elijah McGowan · **Posted:** September 9th, 2013, 9:46 am

I still don't understand why you call this Vision Holy Worlds, because it doesn't seem to be a fitting name, but until we sit down and talk, the three of us, I'll assume you're not elevating your vision of this forum to the level of God's. I'm sorry if I sounded harsh - I was very concerned.

I do disagree that if everyone left HW it would be a good vision abandoned - where there is no vision, the people perish - that's what scripture says. If the populace was alienated, it would show a flaw in the vision itself, it wouldn't be the mistake of all the people.

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes · **Posted:** September 14th, 2013, 3:47 pm

I am sorry this time that I have not posted sooner, but also this time I will make an apology: I and my family went on a two day trip. It was good. And then we were cleaning up for a guest to arrive, and then we spent a day at a fort. It was very good.

Legatus Christo wrote:

A lot has happened but this is the beginning only if we allow it to be. God's name isnt I was it is I AM

Thank you Legatus. I have seen you encouraging people here a lot. I really appreciate it.

BushMaid wrote:

A lot of your post did come across as though it were glorifying the forum too much

Tsahraf ChahsidMimetes wrote:

Should we be proud of Holy Worlds?
Should we be known as Holy Worlders?...

If Holy Worlds is a forum... then the answer is simply,
No.

As firmly as I believe this I know that this is NOT what Holy Worlds is.

Elijah McGowan wrote:

where there is no vision, the people perish - that's what scripture says. If the populace was alienated, it would show a flaw in the vision itself, it wouldn't be the mistake of all the people.

God's Vision for mankind is flawless, and has alienated the vast majority of the people without cessation since the beginning of time. How much more will the Vision to follow God in Fantasy writing alienate? God has plenty of Vision for everyone, yet they still perish, because they are alienated by it; that is their mistake.

Aratrea wrote:

I understand that you defined your terms in the previous post, but it hadn't been as clear as it is now, since, I, at least, was still locked-in to my normal perception of it as a website rather than a goal.

Remember that you also read Inesdar's posts. At the beginning no one seemed to misunderstand. Afterwards most of the posts assumed that I really said what Inesdar said I said, instead of looking to find out if I actually did say it.

Aratrea wrote:

I apologize if my previous post hurt you in any way since I was misinterpreting the meaning of your post.

Thank you Aratrea.

What you said was true about if Holy Worlds lost its Vision, though if it lost its Vision to that extent I would say it was dead already, rather than something that would need to die. And it would still be needful for a group of sincere people to commit to the Vision of Holy Worlds, to provide God glorifying Fantasy.
I will say this: I am not leaving Holy Worlds.

This is the Beginning

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