Okay. I'm just sayin' - it wasn't implied. I was just being dramatic. (Crazy fantasy author...)

A lot of people feel that way, and it's a legitimate usus loquendi within those circles, I guess. Trouble is, of course, you can't really know beforehand whether it's going to be discussion or debate under those definitions. I prefer, if I make any kind of sharp distinction, to use debate when there are defined sides, both convinced of their position and arguing for it, and discussion otherwise, say, when one person has no opinion and is simply examining the views of one that does. But there's definitely overlap.



I'm of European descent and a Europhile(at least as regards historic Europe, not modern leftist Europe), but no, I live in Those United States. What gave you the idea I lived in Europe?



*Puts down shovel and backs away, nodding slowly* OK, whatever you say.



I can't wait!



I don't know, you said more than most(not that that's bad).

Yep. I totally agree. Lots of things are that way though, I think.



You said something about Europe... Let me see....

Ah! Here it is. You said

So I thought maybe you lived in Europe.



Fear in the proper perspective is a good thing, Sam. You will do well here.



*laughs * Yeah, that's common. I have a big mouth and an opinion on everything. *shrugs *

No problem, but I'll have to wait until after the storm.

Only on Holy Worlds...

I think you're right.



Oh. No, not at all. But a great deal of fantasy is set in worlds based on medieval Europe.



That's good to hear.



Yeah, me too. This should be fun.

Yeah, a lot of fantasy is based off of medieval Europe.

@Brendan: Well I know it would be a glorious way to die. Although, I'm not sure Daddy would be thrilled with that...

Sam, in your study of debate have you ever taken a formal logic course?

I took a course from the Teaching Company called Argumentation: The Study of Effective Reasoning.

Why, did I say something illogical?

And also: Do you mean a formal course in logic or a course in formal logic? They'd be different, as I'm sure you know. This was actually both, although it also covered informal logic.

So, Sam, are you a big fan of Greg Bansen? I've studied a lot of his "How to Defend the Christian Faith against All Opposition" series, as well as "The Great Debate", and another one which does not come to mind immediately, and which I cannot go look up because I am away from home at present. I love his stuff, and I especially love how he forces us Christians to stop letting the atheists, agnostics, Buddhists, and so forth, use our set of standards for morality, instead of using their own. Something Christians let them get away with all the time.

Actually, Airianna, I've never heard of Greg Bansen. It sounds, however, from what you said, as though he belongs to the "presuppositional school" of apologetics, which I more or less adhere to. I'll be sure to check him out.

Illogical? No, not at all. I've just studied a small bit of logic (formal and informal were included in the course) and knew that the study of logic ties deeply with effective debate. So I was curious if you'd taken any courses in that regard.

Yes, Greg talks a lot about presuppositional beliefs. I would really check out his stuff. It's very good. I like his two part (16, 1 hour pieces in each part) audio series of "Defending the Christian Worldview". It is my favorite. And it is easier to listen, than read.

Logic is like algebra to me, I'm good at it, but I can't study it without getting confused.

I do not know Sam from anywhere - not that I know of, at least - but I did find the initial post quite aggressive (excluding the sarcasm and 'jokes').

That aside, I'd rather not follow a conversation that increases my blood pressure or makes me want to crawl under my desk. Luckily I can distance myself from this thread.

M

Algebra, ick! *don't let the math geeks in my life know I said that! * *looks around to be sure they did not see this post *

So what got you interested in logic, Sam?

I may be a math geek. I don't really like math(at least not to the point where I'd ever say something like 'Yay! A differential equation!") but I'm pretty good at it and I've developed lots of tricks for doing arithmetic with big numbers in my head. Which is not to say that others haven't probably used all of them before.



I'm a Starrett. As a result, I'm argumentative and opinionated, and rarely shy away from an intellectual fight. I've been debating and enjoying debates for as long as I can remember. Thus, after I had gotten into the Great Courses and when I saw that they had a course in argumentation, it was a natural fit.

Welcome!

Thank you!

My Otherworld is based on something like an ancient Egyptian marsh. It has far more jungles than forests.

From Wikipedia:
"A Jungle (Sanskrit: जंगल) is an area of land in the tropics overgrown with dense vegetation."

However, what I meant by "jungle" is a wet, leafy tree forest with swamps and strange plants and big leaves and swarms of insects.

I forgot this was your introduction thread!

Here comes the swordsman...

A short, lean man dressed in black studded with silver drops from the rafters without a sound; drawing two swords he balances head downwards with his hands on their hilts and their points on the floor. Still balanced on the sword blades he leaps this way and that cutting letters into the stone floor. Then crossing the swords he lowers the hilts to the ground and stands on his hands facing Samstarrett. Still standing on his hands he bows low. The letters read:

My Swords are Yours as you have joined our Brotherhood. May God Bless your work here!



I agree. My own Fantasy may go as far as the Civil War period. Have you read Zane Grey?

Have you watched The Ultimate Proof of Creation? It is about reasoning. It is marvelous.

I've been thinking about it, but I haven't yet. Do you recommend him?

Thanks. I'd hate to have those swords on the other side.



Watched? No, I didn't know it could be watched. I own the book, though.

I wish we had the book!

Sorry, haven't been on any forums for the past...week, I guess. Crazy. Anyway, you can get it on Amazon for $11. http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Proof-Cr ... uckgo-d-20

Algebra? Logic is more like eating food! For me it refreshes and keeps me learning, it is a great tool in debating also. I haven't read up on debating (which I think I might change that) but out of past experience it is simply better to come in as an outsider. Almost taking no side and looking at all of the evidence instead of simply defending yours. Doing things like asking why they believe in what they believe. Try to be the open minded one and look at all reasoning. It kind of makes the other think you are "on their side". If you go right into a debate about let's say... about Jesus. If you say you are a Christian you are going to get stereotyped. I went in to a discussion once and I just stated that I was a Christian and they got REALLY angry at me. I didn't do anything??? I just said what I believed in and they started cussing and stuff... You got to be careful, there are some really hurt people out there who just need to hear love.

Welcome to Holy Worlds, Samstarrett!