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Short hair on men
https://archive.holyworlds.org/viewtopic.php?f=244&t=4433		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 19th, 2011, 4:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Short hair on men
I know we have another thread or two about hairstyles, but this thread has a specific purpose. This thread is for discussing short hairstyles for men.

I have a personal conviction about men's hair being short, so that carries over to my fantasy. Even though longer hair is common for men in fantasy (and arguably historically accurate), I'm inclined to give my gentlemen hairstyles I can be proud of. It's also a matter of personal taste, and I have a hard time envisioning any of my guys in long hair. :P

The exception I might make is for Peter's Angel. Because I'm using colonial clothing and other cultural elements, I may also allow period hair. But I don't have to, since it's fantasy, so I haven't decided yet.

Do any other writers feel the same way? Do any of you have cultures that prefer short hair, even if it's not for conviction or preference reasons? How short is short enough? How do you describe it? What kind of additional styling do your male characters use?

Please, I realize that some people have different convictions about men's hair length, just like they do about women's length. This thread is not for arguing about men's hair - this is a thread for discussing how and why we use short hairstyles in our stories. If you disagree, please take it up in PM.
Author:  Elly [ September 19th, 2011, 4:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I prefer above shoulder length for men in my novels. [Not necessarily a military crew cut or buzz cut, but. . . :roll:]

I'm sure that there are definite pros for shorter hair in fantasy [e.g., especially in dusty deserts and places where the hair would get matted and/or excessively dirty very quickly].
Author:  Riniel Jasmina [ September 19th, 2011, 4:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
My characters from the modern world have shorter hair while my middle aged to old characters tend to have longer hair (think Aragorn and Gandalf). I actually never thought about the 'culture of hair' I just call them as I see them which is usually based off of where they're from. For some reason I can't picture old people in fantasy having short hair...

I don't know if you use these cultures, but for the ancient Asian and American Indians, the top knot or braid was honorable for a man to wear.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 19th, 2011, 4:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Thanks for the replies! :D I'll have to research those cultures, Riniel.

Remember, though - this thread is just for talking about how we use short hair in our stories. If you don't use short hair, or want to talk about longer hairstyles, there's a general thread for that. :D
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 19th, 2011, 5:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I agree, Philli, and have the same views on hair. I am okay with hair that is mid neck length and up, but once it hits the shoulders.... *shrugs *

And no, it isn't just because I'm a military brat.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 19th, 2011, 6:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Do most of your fantasy male characters have short hair then, Airianna? Do they do any kind of specific styling, or do you not specify?

Thanks for posting! :D
Author:  Bethany Faith [ September 19th, 2011, 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I always automatically picture my male characters with short hair, because I just prefer it. Nothing really to do much with personal conviction. :P It could be into relation to the fact that I've always only seen boys with short hair around where I live so I'm used it, my mind is configured to picture boys that way.

I prefer short hair on the boys if I'm reading a book too, since I'm gonna picture them that way no matter what the author says about their hair being long. Just because if I picture a boy with longer hair I confuse my mind. :rofl:
Author:  BushMaid [ September 19th, 2011, 7:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I agree with your convictions, Philly. :D All my male characters have short hair, and it's never more than about three or four inches long. Since most of the men in my writing don't give too much of a thought to their appearance (within decent reason) their hair is usually described as scruffy or unruly. Usually I'll accent the description with the character running his fingers through it, where I can then elaborate it's thickness, wildness, etc. etc.

Plus, I can also model them off my own brothers. :D Two of my brothers have close cut hair about an inch long (I think you guys call them 'buzz cuts'?) which stands up straight. My other two brothers have longer hair on top because it lies flat, and is brushed to the side. So I have plenty of ways to describe the hair of my characters after seeing the many ways my brothers wear theirs. ;)
Author:  Lady Carliss [ September 19th, 2011, 7:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I personally prefer a good clean cut! :rofl:
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 19th, 2011, 7:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I am rather nondescript about it. I mention texture, color, and reference the hair all the time. I never use the term long, but I never use short, either. I sort of give the essence of the hair, and leave the rest to the imagination. :D
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 19th, 2011, 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Yay, responses! :D What I know of as a "buzz cut" is extremely short, shaved pretty close. My brother gets them. Pretty sure it's less than an inch, but not being a barber, I don't know how long guy's hair can get before it starts lying flat. :rofl:

I too usually just describe texture and color and leave length assumed. I don't really know enough to be able to differentiate different styles - hence, I was curious if anyone else had something to share in that department. :D

I'm not good at estimating lengths, so to define what "short enough" is for me, I have to use references. Flynn's hair (from Tangled) is too long for my tastes, but it's not extreme enough to bother me. Does anyone have any idea about how many inches Flynn's hair is?
Author:  Bethany Faith [ September 20th, 2011, 6:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Flynn's hair is maybe two and a half or three inches....not sure, but his bangs are about as long as mine and I'd say mine are three inches so, I was just guessing. :rofl:

If I had to do exact measurements I'd say my male characters usually have two inch hair or a bit shorter, just enough so that it's wavy, but not long enough so that it's...well...long. :P
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 20th, 2011, 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I have used descriptions such as "his hair curled around his ears" or "brushed his shirt collar" before. Those are simple ways to imply length. But most of my characters go without even that.
Author:  Elanhil [ September 20th, 2011, 11:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
*looks at pictures of Flynn* His hair is probably about 2-3 inches, like mine, but mine is curly so it doesn't look as long. :)

I don't really see short 'buzz' cuts for Fantasy characters, not sure why. Most of my characters I would say have hair about like mine or perhaps a tad longer. One of my dwarves does have long hair, but I won't get into that since this thread is talking about short hair. :book:
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 20th, 2011, 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Thanks, Bethy and Caleb! That was very helpful. :D

Those are good descriptions, Airianna.

I think the buzz cut is a pretty modern style, so I could see where it might not fit in fantasy. But that would make it all the more interesting if you did work it into your story!
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 20th, 2011, 1:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Um... I would like to point out that the Romans wore "buzz cuts". So it is not modern.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 20th, 2011, 1:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
How right you are! Thanks for pointing that out. :D
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 20th, 2011, 2:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
*nods * The problem is, we are so accustomed to Hollywood Fantasy, that we forget how often short hair was used on men in history. Honestly, long hair is an extreme impractability for men, especially military men. Lice was a very common problem, and the only way to keep down on lice was to crop men's hair very short so that the lice would not hop from one bunk to the man beside him.

We're just used to Aragorn characters. Now, Royalty is a different story. Lots of royalty had longer hair because it sort of signified that they were not common. They didn't have to deal with those things.

Extremely condensed, and not well rounded history lesson. :P
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 20th, 2011, 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I appreciate the extremely condensed, not-well-rounded history lesson. :D That's helpful and relevant. Thanks, Airianna!

Regardless of whether or not it's historical, long-haired men in fantasy is very popular. Hence, I'm very happy to find others that prefer shorter styles.
Author:  Lady Elanor [ September 20th, 2011, 2:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Granted, Aragorn looked nice in a rugged sort of way; but I really only like short hair on men, so that probably comes across in my stories.
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 20th, 2011, 2:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Looks like lots of us prefer short hair. :D
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 20th, 2011, 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Which is very good to know. :D Most of the time I read fantasy, it seems to be long hair. I knew I couldn't be the only writer that preferred short, however, so I'm glad a thread encouraged some people to post! :D
Author:  Varon [ September 21st, 2011, 8:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Since a lot of my characters are soldiers, most have short hair. High & tight, to be precise.

I don't usually have fantasy people with short hair because the difficulty in keeping it cut without scissors.
Author:  The Bard [ September 21st, 2011, 12:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I can't think of a single fantasy character I have with short hair....hmmm

I guess because I have only done medievalish fantasies.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 25th, 2011, 3:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Inesdar wrote:
I hate messing with my hair. 'Nuff said *wanders off and mumbles*.


Meaning...? You keep your hair cropped so you don't have to do anything with it? Or? :)
Author:  Sienna North [ September 25th, 2011, 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Tough question... I don't usually think about the men's hair. I mean, unless they're, say, dwarves with braided beards or something...

I guess in general it depends on what scissors/razors are available. It would make sense that the Rangers in my story (without much access to civilization) would have longer, unkempt hair (say, shoulder-length or thereabouts), while city men would have shorter hair, well-trimmed. Not sure how I'd communicate that in my story, though.

Personally, my preference ranges from above the shoulders to an inch or two. Nothing too extreme either way.
Author:  Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ September 26th, 2011, 10:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
This is one of those things I never think of... I don't think I've ever put long hair on one of my guy characters. Even if I imagined him that way writing it would get me all tangled up. I don't spend much time actually describing guys hair in general though. :P

One comment I did want to make was make sure your hairstyles match your technology. Scissors are a fairly sophisticated invention, and a lot of cultures might not have them yet, or characters might not possess them. I have no idea how the Romans cut their hair, but chances are a rebel soldier of the same time period wouldn't be able to accomplish the same sort of hair cut.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 26th, 2011, 10:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Good thoughts. I would like to note that they had razors (or something of the sort) in Bible times, because there are several references in the Old Testament to people shaving their previously long hair or beards. How accurate these instruments were I don't know, but it is worth noting.
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 26th, 2011, 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
A razor is actually very accurate. I know a barber who still mostly uses a razor to cut men’s hair. That was actually the way people used to cut their hair, historically, for the very reason that Katie stated. Scissors were very advanced.

It should also be noted that there are different kinds of razors, the flat blade (nicknamed the cut throat blade, which is most popularly seen in movies) being one of the primary, but not the only.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 26th, 2011, 11:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
That was very helpful information, Airianna. Thank you!
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 26th, 2011, 11:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
You are welcome. :)
Author:  Elanhil [ September 27th, 2011, 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
So what would medieval-era men use to achieve buzz cuts?
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 27th, 2011, 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
The razor was introduced during the "Bronze Age" (hates the terms Stone Age, Bronze Age, and Iron Age), which means it was in existence before Christ. Don't ask me the exact year, cause I can't remember, but it was pretty early in the B.C. Era.

The folding aspect, or safety blade feature, on the cut-throat blade was not invented until the 1600s, I do know that, so if you describe the straight/open/cut-throat blade in a medieval book, do not describe anyone opening the blade or flicking the blade open.

So a razor could still work for the medieval era. The reason why we think of most men in the medieval era being wooly haired with long beards is not because they didn’t have razors, but because they lived in stone castles, which were cold, especially in the winter.
Author:  Aemi [ September 27th, 2011, 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
My preference for hair length depends on how masculine it looks. If it is longer than shoulder length, the man runs the risk of looking like a woman from the back, which I don't like at all. It depends on the hair texture: if a man's hair is straight, and/or thin, than it doesn't really look masculine when long (to me!), but if it is curly, than it can be almost to the shoulders and still look good. Flynn Ryder's hair did not bother me at all. And yes, short hair for men is a conviction of mine, too.

So. Anyway, in my story, hair length depends on culture and circumstances. The men of a remote village have their hair about...halfway down their necks, shorter on the sides than on the top, and typically with "bangs". Davien, one of my MCs, lives a rugged, outdoor, traveling life and goes for weeks without a haircut, so his hair is usually long-ish, long enough to start getting in his eyes.
Men in Agrotha (another country) have rather long hair, but it doesn't look so long because it is very curly. (Almost afro texture, almost.) It is long enough to hang close to their eyes, and brush their shoulders.

And it is important to note that the haircut is not cut so that it lines up at the ends, like a girl's, but rather cut somewhat shorter on the sides than on the top. Know what I mean?
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 27th, 2011, 6:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I don't think Flynn Rider's hair is long... I mean, it certainly isn't a High 'n' Tight, but I would not consider that long hair.
Author:  BushMaid [ September 27th, 2011, 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Same here.
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 27th, 2011, 8:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
No, Flynn Rider's hair isn't really "long." I don't think I'd let a son of mine grow it go that long, but that's a matter of personal conviction. "Long" is relative - hence, it helps to define your terms when discussing it.

Great posts, everyone! I'm enjoying them a lot.
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ September 27th, 2011, 9:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
*chuckles * Well I give my brothers flat tops/high n tights every 3 weeks, so the likelihood of my sons having Flynn Rider hair is pretty nonexistent, but his length of hair doesn't bother me on other people. :)

Get much longer, though, and I mean not much at all, and I no longer find it reasonable length. :D

That being said, I know men with hair longer than Flynn Rider’s, and I’m still very good friends with them, so I say all of this with the way I would have things, in a perfect world, as opposed to how things are in my life. :D
Author:  RedWing the Purple [ September 28th, 2011, 10:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Long hair on guys has never bothered me at all (even long hair like Legolas' length) so... likewise, some of my characters have long hair. I'm fine with it as long as it doesn't look girly.

In the Graylands (Underlands), long hair signifies a higher rank, and the lower-class and more common-folk have shorter hair - though, in the Graylands, hair length is longer in general. Those in the Rebellion also have long hair. In Allikkai (The Overlands), the Magicians often have longer hair, at least in some parts. They think it looks distinguished and wise... but for the most part, men have short hair. Breyanna at one point makes a passing comment on how men's hair in the Graylands is longer then she's used to, and can't help but think of them all as Magicians, even though half of them don't even know what magic is.

If short hair, though, is your conviction, of course that's fine. :D
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ September 28th, 2011, 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I agree, Airianna. We can't control what other people do with their hair, but we are in control of our book characters. So the point of this thread isn't to argue the morality of short hair for men, or even decide "how short is short enough" (though it's helpful for people to specify how they define short for their own characters, so we can have an idea of what they're talking about), but rather to encourage each other as we chop the locks off our manly fictional creations. :D (And also figure out how to describe it accurately, and all that technical stuff.)
Author:  Laura Elizabeth [ October 14th, 2011, 10:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I guess I kind of unconsciously use short hair. It is definitely my conviction that men should have short hair. However, for someone like Aragorn or Faramir, etc. I don't have a problem with it. Why? I would have used to, but my dad explains it like this: They didn't have a barber shop. :D Therefore, they wouldn't have gotten a haircut nearly as often. Also, if they were wandering around all over the place, they might not have come upon whatever primitive style barbershop there was. (I added this one) Also, their hair is short compared to the women's hair.

So, it doesn't bother me, as long as it isn't combed real smooth and sissified. (which is what really annoys me about Aragorn's crowning. If he could get it all nice and brushed, why couldn't he have cut it a bit?)
Author:  Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ October 17th, 2011, 6:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Yeah, Zaciré's hair in my novel grows long for that same reason, Laura. :)

eru
Author:  Lady Elanor [ October 18th, 2011, 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
That thought had not occurred to me, Laura. Thanks for sharing! :)
Author:  Varon [ October 19th, 2011, 8:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
There's also their culture to consider. In some cultures, men are expected to have longer hair. In others, they're expected to have shorter. That would also define how they wear their hair.

How many types hairstyles are there? *is clueless*
Author:  Elanhil [ October 19th, 2011, 9:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Varon wrote:
How many types of styles of are there? *is clueless*
Styles of hair? Endless.
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ October 19th, 2011, 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Yeah, endless. :P
Author:  Rachel Newhouse [ October 19th, 2011, 10:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Very good point, Varon! Because of that, we as fantasy writers have the option to design our fictional cultures such that short hair is expected for men. (If we believe that men should have short hair IRL.)
Author:  Varon [ October 19th, 2011, 11:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
Or if they even grow their hair... *ponders* It would save a lot of grief if everyone was bald.
Author:  Airianna Valenshia [ October 19th, 2011, 11:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
*laughs *
Author:  Varon [ October 19th, 2011, 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Short hair on men
I think I'll do it in one of my projects.
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