Holy Worlds Christian Forum :: View topic - Magic as an Animate Character

What if, in this world i'm dreaming up...Magic was a character? It had rules of how you could use it? It might cheat, or betray you, or it might smile on you and help you be strong?

I also don't really want it to be quite so personal, Griffin, because of the possible similarities to a deity.

Do ya'll think I would need to explain this? Or could I just not figure it out and write about it anyway?

(I hate doing that though.:P)

Right now I'm picturing a Balrog-like character that runs around and does errands for people when they ask him and if he wants to. Not sure how that fits with your ideas.

Ooooooh! I like that idea Neil!

But...then it would be kind of like people calling on a witch for help.

And I really hesitate to use the word familiar.

Hmmm... So what you're saying is that "magic" is actually a person who administrates the natural power in this world?

Such a character would need something holding him down. He/it would have way too much power having control over all the magic in the universe, and a mind to boot.

lol! So you're saying he'd basically be like a wizard, but the only wizard? And maybe he doesn't have a sinful nature, so would never desire to hold the magic all to himself and not 'share'.

Oooooh, so you'd have to make a journey every time you wanted something done? That sounds inconvenient, but could be interesting... I'd imagined it initially as something you almost...called up.

That was dangerous. Almost like hiring a rogue assassin.

Hmmmm....those ideas are interesting! I like them!

So this guy is merely the "ruler" of magic. Said magic exists without him, but can only be controlled with this "ruler's" help.

but then, where would the magic come from...

Inless maybe it was just a natural force in this world. But then how would this "ruler" guy be able to control it and no one else could?

Why not make him a god or three? Let me elaborate? Nature gods exist frequently in fantasy, you know, like Naiads, Draiads, and so on. Why not have a specific race (almost) that was the guiding hand of magic and had a close relationship with said force? This would open up all sorts of interesting possibilities except it's pretty different from what you three have come up with (which sounds very cool, by the way)

eruheran

You mean as in a mythical-ish god, like as in the water god in Prince Caspian?

Well, you could make an elemental race, but I was pretty sure she wanted magic as a character, not as a group of characters.

Oooh, how did this race die, and how does this last being not go crazy without any of his kin?

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ September 27th, 2010, 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Magic as an Animate Character
So the other day, while considering a story for my Nano, this notion popped into my head. What if, in this world I'm dreaming up...Magic was a character? It had rules of how you could use it? It might cheat, or betray you, or it might smile on you and help you be strong? Or would it be better just to have it be alive somehow? But not fully capable of thought? Like an animal? Can any of you help me develop this? Ask me questions or anything? I'm still a little confused by the idea. LOL! so. yeah. One thing I'm wondering is, would it need to be a spirit of some sort? I don't really want to deal with it in a way that magicians become necromancers.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ September 28th, 2010, 12:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Quote: What if, in this world i'm dreaming up...Magic was a character? It had rules of how you could use it? It might cheat, or betray you, or it might smile on you and help you be strong? Love this thought process! Very interesting. I like the thought that magic can work against you and not always for you. So, if I understand you correctly, you’re talking about magic being a character like The Ring in LofR is, right? I think that would work really well and be an interesting spin off magic, but I’m not sure I’d like having a real flesh and blood character walking around. Personally I don’t like the animal thought process. Just my personal thoughts. I don’t believe in squashing creativity, so don’t let my thoughts dissuade you from what you want to do. Run with these thoughts until you either figure out their flaws, or come to a dead end.

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ September 29th, 2010, 10:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Well, see that's my problem. I'm REALLY not sure how to go about portraying magic. I KNOW I don't want a person or something. But what exactly was IN the Ring? I think it was an evil spirit. I think. Or part of an evil spirit. But I don't want magic to be spirit linked, because that would be sorcery and I don't want it to be like that exactly. lol. See my dilemma?

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ September 30th, 2010, 8:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Okay, so make it so that magic is an inner part of the creation, a side effect, if you will, of the fall. Magic is linked to sin in your world. It entered the races when they became sinful. Make it not a spirit, but a contributing part of the evil within. Does that make sense?

Author:	Seer of Endor [ September 30th, 2010, 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow, I think it would be very possible to have magic be fully sentient without being a spirit or anything. You could have it be like a sentient force that people call on to use. It would be a bit of an out there concept, but I think you could pull it off with a little carfeul worldbuilding.

Holy Worlds Christian Forum https://archive.holyworlds.org/

Magic as an Animate Character https://archive.holyworlds.org/viewtopic.php?f=244&t=1055	Page 1 of 2

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 1st, 2010, 9:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Well, see...I'm also trying to stay away from the whole Star Wars "force" kind of thing. The only other option that I can see would be having magic like an omnipresent consciousness. Or this weird being that can somehow see everything. But that sounds like a weird, distorted view of God.:P

Author:	Seer of Endor [ October 1st, 2010, 10:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
By giving it sentience and a conscious personality, you would totally avoid the SW "force" thing. Also, when I say a force, I don't mean like the SW force that runs through everything, but rather the common source of magic (whatever it may be) that is sentient and unpredictable.

Author:	Arias Mimetes [ October 1st, 2010, 10:52 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Maybe a person that has qualities like magic? Some people treat the character as a servant, using him to do different things for them, but they don't always know if he'll obey. Like the One Ring, which had powers and seemingly a mind of its own, except this is a person. Some people don't know magic is bad, so maybe there would be some people who don't realize how harmful it could be to rely on this character to do things for them. I don't know if that was helpful or more confusing, but hopefully it gave you some ideas.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ October 1st, 2010, 2:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
It may be easier, but don't settle for something you don't want. Hold out for the Lord to give you an 'Ah ha!' moment. You’ll be more satisfied with your book in the end and it will be unique in its own way.

Author:	Elanhil [ October 2nd, 2010, 5:46 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Right now I'm picturing a Balrog-like character that runs around and does errands for people when they ask him and if he wants to. Not sure how that fits with your ideas.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ October 2nd, 2010, 7:19 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
I was waiting for you to pop back up Elanhil. Your prolonged silence was eerie.

Author:	Kiev Shawn [ October 2nd, 2010, 1:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Hmm... Balrogs... shudder (Did anyone else freak out about those when first reading LOTR?) This is an interesting concept. It would be interesting to see how it plays out. If you used it one way though, it could look like witchcraft if they call on 'Magic', or something like that.

Author:	Lord Kieren Mimetes [ October 6th, 2010, 12:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Perhaps it could be a being and knows when someone asks it to do something, if 'Magic' wants, it is done without him/her lifting a finger. Perhaps it could even be your main character, but no one knows he/she is really 'Magic.' It would interesting to be in the mind of 'Magic.'

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 7th, 2010, 10:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
See, this is all sounding so much like witchcraft in our world, that I hesitate to use it, no matter how cool it is. I also don't really want it to be quite so personal, Griffin, because of the possible similarities to a deity. Do ya'll think I would need to explain this? Or could I just not figure it out and write about it anyway? (I hate doing that though.:P)

Author:	Lord Kieren Mimetes [ October 8th, 2010, 9:00 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow Wenial wrote: I also don't really want it to be quite so personal, Griffin, because of the possible similarities to a deity. Do ya'll think I would need to explain this? Or could I just not figure it out and write about it anyway? (I hate doing that though.:P) Hmm, I see what you're saying. Maybe you could make it so that 'Magic' could not do anything unless asked by a someone else. Or is that still to powerful or to personal? You wouldn't have to figure everything, but it might make it easier in the long run.

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 8th, 2010, 9:34 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
What if magic is a force, but there is a being (I believe they are called "familiars") that is the manifestation of that force. Which the force of magic itself is not sentient, this being gives magic a mind. But don't make the being like the Ring. Instead, it should be very fickle, it's relationships with people very superficial. For some reason, it seems like the character should be very self serving. Not necessarily good or evil, just like gravity isn't good or evil but both can use it and be abused by it.

Author:	6stringedsignseeker [ October 8th, 2010, 1:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Elanhil wrote: Right now I'm picturing a Balrog-like character that runs around and does errands for people when they ask him and if he wants to. Not sure how that fits with your ideas. "Balrog, fetch my slippers. Good, Boy, Balrog!" hehehe sorry.... couldn't help it.

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 8th, 2010, 10:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Ooooooh! I like that idea Neil! But...then it would be kind of like people calling on a witch for help. And I really hesitate to use the word familiar.

Author:	Elanhil [ October 8th, 2010, 11:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
The more I think about it, the more this seems it might be portrayed as something demonic. I wouldn't do it, if I were you for fear of being taken the wrong way.

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 9th, 2010, 10:54 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow Wenial wrote: Ooooooh! I like that idea Neil! But...then it would be kind of like people calling on a witch for help. And I really hesitate to use the word familiar. Well, except that a witch is really human, and really practices witchcraft. In this case, you have a cobha, and then you have being that acts like the mind of the cobha, if you will. Well, I was just trying to say familiar so you could get an idea of what I was getting at. I would never use the word, either. Just think as if you have a character that is the wind. Only, your character is the cobha.

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 9th, 2010, 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Hmmm... So what you're saying is that "magic" is actually a person who administrates the natural power in this world?

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 9th, 2010, 8:24 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow Wenial wrote: Hmmm... So what you're saying is that "magic" is actually a person who administrates the natural power in this world? Sort of. He's really like a mind for the magic, he can think for it, bend the entire system to his will if he wants, feels the use of magic, etc.

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 11th, 2010, 12:19 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
That is a really cool idea. I'd need to think about it some more and figure out how it would work, but that sounds fun! The only problem is the problem of contacting this person...calling on them, etc...

Author:	Elanhil [ October 11th, 2010, 8:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Such a character would need something holding him down. He/it would have way too much power having control over all the magic in the universe, and a mind to boot.

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 11th, 2010, 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Elanhil wrote: Such a character would need something holding him down. He/it would have way too much power having control over all the magic in the universe, and a mind to boot. Actually, not much power. Just limit your magic. Contacting this person isn't a problem: just cross the River Doom, defeat the Dragons of Infinity, and be willingly to do his laundry for him.

Author:	Elanhil [ October 12th, 2010, 6:39 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
lol! So you're saying he'd basically be like a wizard, but the only wizard? And maybe he doesn't have a sinful nature, so would never desire to hold the magic all to himself and not 'share'.

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 12th, 2010, 11:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Elanhil wrote: lol! So you're saying he'd basically be like a wizard, but the only wizard? And maybe he doesn't have a sinful nature, so would never desire to hold the magic all to himself and not 'share'. No, it's different than that. Magic is a force, and he is the representative, the will, and a body for that force. Actually, an interesting idea has struck me. Write a fairy tale style story, and have this character be allegorical for Jesus. (Just remember, if you use black magic, that's it's just His own power abused by Demons. It's not some kind of counter-power.)

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 12th, 2010, 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Oooooh, so you'd have to make a journey every time you wanted something done? That sounds inconvenient, but could be interesting... I'd imagined it initially as something you almost...called up. That was dangerous. Almost like hiring a rogue assassin.

Author:	Elanhil [ October 12th, 2010, 8:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Hmm...I still have trouble wrapping my mind around this. It would be hard to explain in a book.

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 12th, 2010, 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow Wenial wrote: Oooooh, so you'd have to make a journey every time you wanted something done? That sounds inconvenient, but could be interesting... I'd imagined it initially as something you almost...called up. That was dangerous. Almost like hiring a rogue assassin. Not exactly. Magic, the force, can be used without him. But if you want to ensure success, stop an enemy's magic, or you need power that you can't wield, you'll have to go to the Mind. Another idea: Magic, the character, uses his incredible awesome position in life to make himself a very great (but completely self interested) and wealthy man. He generally gives his services to the highest bidder or the winning side. What if the plot involves his own character conflict (as a side plot, he's not the MC) and having to decide to choose doing the right thing over satisfying his desires.

Author:	Willow Wenial Mimetes [ October 13th, 2010, 9:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Hmmmm....those ideas are interesting! I like them! So this guy is merely the "ruler" of magic. Said magic exists without him, but can only be controlled with this "ruler's" help. But then, where would the magic come from... Unless maybe it was just a natural force in this world. But then how would this "ruler" guy be able to control it and no one else could?

Author:	Neil of Erk [ October 13th, 2010, 5:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Willow Wenial wrote: Hmmmm....those ideas are interesting! I like them! So this guy is merely the "ruler" of magic. Said magic exists without him, but can only be controlled with this "ruler's" help. but then, where would the magic come from... Inless maybe it was just a natural force in this world. But then how would this "ruler" guy be able to control it and no one else could? It's a natural force, and this being was created to rule it. He has free will, and has chosen, for the time, to follow his own way rather than God's.

Author:	Elanhil [ October 13th, 2010, 8:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
So he is like the guiding hand of magic? No-one can use magic apart from him?

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ October 14th, 2010, 8:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Magic as an Animate Character
Why not make him a god or three? Let me elaborate? Nature gods exist frequently in fantasy, you know, like Naiads, Draiads, and so on. Why not have a specific race (almost) that was the guiding hand of magic and had a close relationship with said force? This would open up all sorts of interesting possibilities except it's pretty different from what you three have come up with (which sounds very cool, by the way) eruheran