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I'll be the one who goes against what everyone else says. Sometimes false gods do have power. Satanic cults and the like involve the worship of real beings and those fallen angels do have a measure of power, just like humans have a measure of power.

The key is to show that the real beings portraying themselves as gods are false. They are 'pretenders' to the throne of God. They do have power, but they aren't all-powerful and are not God.

I guess it would depend on how you define the word 'god'.
I would define 'god' (emphasis on the small case) as anything/anyone that is being worshiped (whether an idol or demon or whatever).

If you define 'god' the same way you define 'God' then yes, demons would not be 'gods'.

I do not deny that demons have power to give these false gods power which is superhuman and unexplainable to our minds.

When I think "God" in terms of a fantasy world I think "deity of some kind",

What I do deny, and will go down to my grave denying, is that any of that power could ever be on a level with the true God.

But what about on Earth? There are references to Molech, Ashtoreth, and plenty of other false gods. I'm no bible scholar, but I've always assumed that at least one of those idols had a demon behind it.

I guess I'm thinking more of throwing in some Zeus/Mars/Venus/etc. figure into fantasy.

...and Lewis pulled from it for the Eldila in the Space Trilogy.

Would it be possible for different races to have a false god (Elves have theirs, Dwarves have theirs), and the MC learns about it, but doesn't try to convert the race. Is it alright to do that, or should an MC try to introduce them to the real God? (Without the author coming across as over the top preachy, or something of the sort. If I used the wrong word, let me know, and I'll change it)

I have some false gods in my world (though they don't play into my book). False gods are mentioned in the Bible (Baal, Asherah, etc) multiple times. I think the key thing to keep in mind is that these are false gods.

They have no real power. The Bible made clear that next to God, these 'gods' were poor excuses for anything to worship. I think as long as we make that distinction in our novels, we're within what the Bible teaches.

Where you run into trouble is when you start portraying those false gods as true (This is where having a book character adhere to one of these gods gets difficult). Personally, that's what I haven't mentioned any false gods in my novels yet; I don't feel I can accurately show how un-powerful they are to even stick in there.

My 0.02

eru

Author:	Aris Hunter [ September 7th, 2011, 3:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Multiple deities?
This came to mind a while ago. I've never been comfortable the idea of having multiple gods in my world. But recently-sh I've been wondering if there's a good way to safely have them. I mean, I know there is, but is there way, should I decide to have a false god (having of course the true God), is there a way I can do it without me feeling weird about it, or is the whole idea not a good one? What are your guys' opinions?

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ September 7th, 2011, 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I have some false gods in my world (though they don't play into my book). False gods are mentioned in the Bible (Baal, Asherah, etc) multiple times. I think the key thing to keep in mind is that these are false gods. They have no real power. The Bible made clear that next to God, these 'gods' were poor excuses for anything to worship. I think as long as we make that distinction in our novels, we're within what the Bible teaches. Where you run into trouble is when you start portraying those false gods as true (This is where having a book character adhere to one of these gods gets difficult). Personally, that's what I haven't mentioned any false gods in my novels yet; I don't feel I can accurately show how un-powerful they are to even stick in there. My 0.02 eru

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ September 7th, 2011, 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
False gods exist wherever you go, the question is whether or not people actually recognize them as false or not. Based on Eruheran's answer, this is what I think you're asking. In my novel Lightning Ranger I have false religion after false religion after false religion. Some are blood thirsty, some are licentious, some are merely fluff. I didn't at first realize that this was going to be such a theme, but every where my MC turns there's another empty faith being crammed down his throat. I don't ever offer him a true religion. In the face of so many empty ones it would seem like just another of the same, this being a fantasy world and all. What I did was create rumour, a hint, and it nags and taunts him. Because he recognizes the false ones for what they are every time he encounters a new false god it reinforces his belief that behind all the facades there must be a true one, somewhere. So, all that to say, definitely you can have false gods and false religions. They exist in the real world, after all, and they can be a very, very powerful tool.

Author:	Crushmaster [ September 7th, 2011, 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
False gods that don't exist (all gods other than our God), sure. Actual "gods" with actual power...Err...no. God bless, Crushmaster.

Author:	Calenmiriel [ September 7th, 2011, 10:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I'm also of the same mindset of eruheran and Jaynin. I don't think it's a problem as long as you don't give them power. Like it's mentioned above, those "gods' wouldn't have actual power since our God is the only true God. I don't even think it's a problem if you use false gods to help your main character find the true God. Those types of stories are real and still happen today. I think I went in circles there a bit, but I think you get my point. ~Calen

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Author:	Suiauthon Mimetes [ September 7th, 2011, 11:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I'll be the one who goes against what everyone else says. Sometimes false gods do have power. Satanic cults and the like involve the worship of real beings and those fallen angels do have a measure of power, just like humans have a measure of power. The key is to show that the real beings portraying themselves as gods are false. They are 'pretenders' to the throne of God. They do have power, but they aren't all-powerful and are not God.

Author:	Crushmaster [ September 8th, 2011, 12:38 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Suiauthon wrote: I'll be the one who goes against what everyone else says. Sometimes false gods do have power. Satanic cults and the like involve the worship of real beings and those fallen angels do have a measure of power, just like humans have a measure of power. The key is to show that the real beings portraying themselves as gods are false. They are 'pretenders' to the throne of God. They do have power, but they aren't all-powerful and are not God. That's true, but they're not "gods", they're just demons. I actually think all of us would agree with what you said. God bless, Crushmaster.

Author:	Calenmiriel [ September 8th, 2011, 12:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I do agree that there are forces out there that do receive (and could very well be) the power of the devil. I do not believe they are "gods" themselves, but rather demons/fallen angels, spirits, ghosts, ect. Trust me, we have friends who have dealt with that who are not of the faith. ~Calen Edit: Crushmaster sort of posted just before I did, so I'll just back him up on that. ^^

Author:	Suiauthon Mimetes [ September 8th, 2011, 1:19 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I guess it would depend on how you define the word 'god'. I would define 'god' (emphasis on the small case) as anything/anyone that is being worshiped (whether an idol or demon or whatever). If you define 'god' the same way you define 'God' then yes, demons would not be 'gods'.

Author:	Crushmaster [ September 8th, 2011, 3:23 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Suiauthon wrote: I guess it would depend on how you define the word 'god'. I would define 'god' (emphasis on the small case) as anything/anyone that is being worshiped (whether an idol or demon or whatever). If you define 'god' the same way you define 'God' then yes, demons would not be 'gods'. When I think "God" in terms of a fantasy world I think "deity of some kind", so I guess it's just a matter of different definitions. I agree with all you've said, though. God bless, Crushmaster.

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ September 8th, 2011, 6:02 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I agree with Crush, Sui, in that I think our interpretations of the definition are differing. I do not deny that demons have power to give these false gods power which is superhuman and unexplainable to our minds. What I do deny, and will go down to my grave denying, is that any of that power could ever be on a level with the true God. Hope that helps, eru

Author:	Roundelais [ September 9th, 2011, 12:57 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I'm pretty sure that Lewis and Tolkien both held the view that the pantheistic deities of various cultures were based on observed exertion of angelic/demonic power. Tolkien made use of that concept with the Valar, as previously mentioned, and Lewis pulled from it for the Eldila in the Space Trilogy. If I'm remembering correctly, the notion is presented in That Hideous Strength that the pantheon of gods that the Greeks worshiped was the "bent" perception of the eldila of the other planets. For what it's worth, both authors had an affinity for the Nordic pantheon and mythologies, not just the Greek. Being fond of mythology (as they were), I find the concept appealing in a fantasy setting: a group of powerful spirits with various areas of dominion and specialty - though like Lewis and Tolkien I'd keep them subordinate to their Creator. Any defiant ones that sought to elevate themselves to His level would be in the same boat as Lucifer and Melkor. Any humans who sought to elevate one of them to the same (or a higher) level as the Creator would be.... deluding themselves. And possibly others. And that's where it ties back into the concept of false gods.

Author:	Suiauthon Mimetes [ September 9th, 2011, 1:03 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Roundelais wrote: ...and Lewis pulled from it for the Eldila in the Space Trilogy. I had forgotten about that. I completely agree with what you said.

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ September 9th, 2011, 7:20 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
@Mark: No, I wasn't saying you said that, just clarifying. Hm. Subordinate angels is really an interesting topic, too. watches topic eru

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Author:	Aris Hunter [ September 9th, 2011, 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Would it be possible for different races to have a false god (Elves have theirs, Dwarves have theirs), and the MC learns about it, but doesn't try to convert the race? Is it alright to do that, or should an MC try to introduce them to the real God? (Without the author coming across as over the top preachy, or something of the sort. If I used the wrong word, let me know, and I'll change it.)

Author:	Crushmaster [ September 9th, 2011, 3:38 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Lady Aris Lillylight wrote: Would it be possible for different races to have a false god (Elves have theirs, Dwarves have theirs), and the MC learns about it, but doesn't try to convert the race. Is it alright to do that, or should an MC try to introduce them to the real God? (Without the author coming across as over the top preachy, or something of the sort. If I used the wrong word, let me know, and I'll change it) "Convert", no; I've been accused of this Online, but the fact is, I can't convert anyone; God has to do that. Preach the Gospel, absolutely. Tell them of the judgment to come. After all, we wouldn't just let them go their own way in real life, would we? But, then again, I guess we do that all the time, don't we? God bless, Crushmaster.

Author:	Svensteel Mimetes [ September 11th, 2011, 8:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I have a few "demi-god" type superior beings. They only have a bit of power, like kings of their little kingdom. But they are all controlled by the main God. Who is the actual representation of God.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ September 12th, 2011, 9:18 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
Very interesting topic. I'm too late to add much, but I agree with what has been said.

Author:	Laura Elizabeth [ September 26th, 2011, 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Multiple deities?
I have false gods in my world. In Rinadrion, there are three main gods, and one main goddess. In Relastin there are simply 'the gods', which don't have names as of yet. They're basically the typical gods of nature, blah blah. As long as we make distinctions between the false gods and the true God, and show the false gods to either have no power, or to have evil power from the Devil and demons, then there should be no problem. Let the atheists complain about it.