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Here are some points in the sidekick trend a lot of plots follow -

Where the main characters are dashing, good looking, and (generally) in full control of their situation, sidekicks appear as more down-to-earth, plain, and often unsure of what is going on.

Main characters (generally) think they know everything, yet at the most critical time, it's the sidekick that supplies the answer.

Sidekicks usually stand by and watch the main characters live "happily ever after" with their prince or princess Charming, yet they remain loyal to their friend.

Sidekicks supply comic relief in the tensest of situations, and often give everyone something to laugh about when they need it most.

Sidekicks are awesome! They are very often my favourite characters in everything, and it breaks my heart that so many of them die.

* whispers * I just killed a sidekick at the end of one of my books...

On another note, does this apply to the Mentor Death Syndrome in many stories? The death of the Mentor forces the hero to venture forth into the world on their own, with their new, feeble powers, thus raising the stakes and suspicion over whether the hero will attain the goal.

True, Eru. The sidekick is usually a tag-along for the MC, but a mentor is the MC's... well, mentor.

The difference is hard to put into words...

What do you guys think? Is it unrealistic for a series to end with all its main characters still in tact? Or do you find a book better if it is more life-like? (and usually, not so happy?)

BushMaid wrote:

What do you guys think? Is it unrealistic for a series to end with all its main characters still in tact? Or do you find a book better if it is more life-like? (and usually, not so happy?)

No, I think it's fine either way. In one series, for example (pretty much my only fantasy series, though I recently kinda gained a new one), in the past, I had it planned where maybe a handful would die (e.g., my character's mentor [I write in first/third-person, always...I used to write all first-person, but that's crazy]), but most would live.

I don't like killing characters off.

God bless,
Crushmaster.

I do. I have my main characters in my main books which I keep for a while until I eventually kill most of them in my second or third part. I have many characters though that come and go; they either die, betray the group causing them to die or end up dead. My world is in a brutal war killing millions and it makes sense for most of them to die (plus it creates emotional tension *evil laugh*) in one way or another. Very few of my characters actually live to the end of the story. For me, it's fun.

Aeleknight wrote:

Man. We need to have you in chat and do the *Prepares to be evil* thing.

God bless,
Crushmaster.

Author:	BushMaid [ July 10th, 2011, 5:15 pm ]
Post subject:	Dead Sidekick Syndrome
(I tried to find if there was similar thread to this one, but couldn't find one) In just about every plot - excusing the exceptions - there is a main character or characters. To help said main character/s, authors usually equip them with something vitally important they could never do without: a sidekick. Sidekicks come in all shapes, sizes and personalities, however there are some characteristics to a sidekick that makes him or her different from the main characters. Here are some points in the sidekick trend a lot of plots follow - Where the main characters are dashing, good looking, and (generally) in full control of their situation, sidekicks appear as more down-to-earth, plain, and often unsure of what is going on. Main characters (generally) think they know everything, yet at the most critical time, it's the sidekick that supplies the answer. Sidekicks usually stand by and watch the main characters live "happily ever after" with their prince or princess Charming, yet they remain loyal to their friend. Sidekicks supply comic relief in the tensest of situations, and often give everyone something to laugh about when they need it most. Sidekicks are often overlooked, even though they are brilliant in the best and most unique way. Which leads me to the saddest point in the sidekick cliche: many sidekicks often die for the sake of the main character/s, sacrificing their life for the "greater good". This has to be the most frustrating thing in fiction for me. Sidekicks are awesome! They are very often my favourite characters in everything, and it breaks my heart that so many of them die. It is tragic! And yet, in my current plot I'm working on, I have found myself following the exact same thing. For the plot's sake, I think the death of my sidekick will make a more powerful ending. However I can't stand the thought that I'm killing off such a good character; one that I love. I also know that this won't sit well with my audience if they like this character... especially my sister. Sister: "No!! You can't kill Kent!" Me: So I've hit a quandary and I'm wondering what you guys think. How do you like your sidekicks? Dead or alive?

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ July 10th, 2011, 5:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Oooh, see, I'm the opposite. I let my sidekicks live while I kill off the main characters. runs down list of novels Yup, dead main characters most of the time. More impact that way. (If anyone wants me to elaborate on any of my books I'll be happy to. But I refuse to start lest I end up just talking for several thousand words about all the deaths in all my novels...)

Author:	BushMaid [ July 10th, 2011, 6:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Wow, really Vanya? Do expand! I'd like to hear more.

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ July 10th, 2011, 6:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Wow, really? Do you have a particular sidekick of mine you'd like to hear about? In the novel I just finished (Third Earth) you could say that I killed the sidekick, but I'd argue over who was the sidekick. It was Dorus story, but the plot revolved around Karistome. He was the POV character, but the story was about her. He lived to serve her, and just because he's the main character doesn't mean he's the main character. So that's kind of a gray line. The story I'm writing now I kill what is clearly the MC. I have 8 "Main characters" five of which have POV's, but this is the primary POV character and everything kind of revolves around him. The other guy who could be considered just as important really plays the part of a sidekick. (Is younger, terrified, etc.) Because the MC (whose name I will not disclose for spoiler reasons at this point) is such a major player he's a prime candidate to get killed. When we reached the climax of the book and discover what sacrifices must be made to set all right again he's the logical choice for me to kill, because he has the most to loose. The sidekick is, well, a sidekick. If he died it would be sad, but bearable, and since he's the one who got everyone into this to begin with, it would seem a just ending. If it was one of the other major characters their deaths would just seem really pointless. "Oh, they died, but we got the gate closed, so who cares?" Which I won't do. If I'm going to do that I'll close the gate without anyone dying. But, by killing the MC I make everyone else in the story absolutely miserable. And it's a huge, huge sacrifice, rather than a minor one. (And it's a nice setup for a sequel but I didn't realize that until later.) And then there's the Prince of Yen. First let me explain that Janin and I argued long and hard over who was going to be the main character of that novel. He won, but I made sure I won too. He's the MC, but he's not a POV character, and he dies. So the book is split between two POVs, his best friend (sidekick) and his brother (narrator.) A lot of bad things happen to Janin. Like... a lot of bad things. Killing off his sidekick wouldn't really help me fix anything, just add to a pile of bad things. There'd be no impact for the reader, and it would leave a whole mess of loose ends. It would be awful! But by killing Janin I can tidy up everyone else's character arc; reform a villain, prove the villain's point, etc. It's a beautifully tragic ending. It's a purposeful death. So there's three... and like I said, I could keep going.

Author:	BushMaid [ July 10th, 2011, 7:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
They all sound awesome! Thanks for telling me about them, Vanya! I can't say I've read many books where the MC dies; in fact, I actually can't think of even one right now! So I'm not sure how I would react to a MC dying... shall have to read Vanya's books so she can find out It's when the very loyal and best friend sidekicks die is when I get upset. It's when the author creates such a lovable and awesome only to have them die, it just seems... criminal. And I'm doing it! Argh!!

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Author:	Skathi [ July 11th, 2011, 5:43 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
BushMaid wrote: Here are some points in the sidekick trend a lot of plots follow - Where the main characters are dashing, good looking, and (generally) in full control of their situation, sidekicks appear as more down-to-earth, plain, and often unsure of what is going on. Main characters (generally) think they know everything, yet at the most critical time, it's the sidekick that supplies the answer. Sidekicks usually stand by and watch the main characters live "happily ever after" with their prince or princess Charming, yet they remain loyal to their friend. Sidekicks supply comic relief in the tensest of situations, and often give everyone something to laugh about when they need it most. In most of these situations I reverse the roles of MC and sidekick! Only the MC never listens to the sidekick. Dead or alive? Alive, because I like them too much to kill them off!

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ July 11th, 2011, 9:33 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I think I wrote a short story once where the sidekick died. Actually, I think I'm going to write a short story at some point where the sidekick dies. It'll be an interesting new experience. I have siblings who won't read my books because I kill off their favorite characters.

Author:	Svensteel Mimetes [ July 11th, 2011, 11:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
The current book on my plate right now; his sidekick dies, along with most of the people with him. I would kill off the MC but he needs to be in other books... In my other book that I am kind of working on now; the main character dies along with other characters, but he is later brought back to life (him being the "Jesus" of the book)

Author:	Aeleknight [ July 11th, 2011, 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
In my main series most of my heroes (including sidekicks and main characters) die in the end. However it is a little difficult to tell who is the main character in my story since I focus on at least four characters simultaneously. However I know for a fact two main characters live and three sidekicks live at the end while the remaining characters all die. In my Novella I have been working on the main character dies in the end. I guess it really has to do with what you want to do with the story. It is kind of hard for me to tell since I have several main characters and many sidekicks that all join and die.

Author:	Celestria [ July 11th, 2011, 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I, and my MC's, have determined that we like our sidekicks alive. Several times now though we've found them dead. Just wait until I fully unleash my MC hero. Then my villain is going to get what's been coming to him.

Author:	Leandra Falconwing [ July 13th, 2011, 10:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
BushMaid wrote: Sidekicks are awesome! They are very often my favourite characters in everything, and it breaks my heart that so many of them die. Yes! I so often find myself attached to a sidekick or other somewhat minor character, more so than the hero. Sidekicks are the best. And I like my sidekicks alive. Of course, I like most of my characters alive...I don't kill them off very often.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ July 13th, 2011, 10:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Well, I guess I like my sidekicks too. Chalice would sort of be the sidekick, I guess, and everyone loves her. She's where most of the humor comes into my story.

Author:	Melody Kondrael [ July 14th, 2011, 7:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I try not to kill anybody off, actually.... But the most notable death in my stories is actually a mentor figure who has had MC status in the past. Not a sidekick. XD

Author:	Lady Eruwaedhiel [ July 14th, 2011, 11:37 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I kinda get around this problem by making all my 3D characters equally important and giving them all MC status and then letting the others die off as they please. 'Course, that gets confusing. I'm too attached to most of my minor characters, even, to let many of them die off. So the characters only die off if A) I feel bad about letting so many people live or B) They need to die for the purpose of the story. Which doesn't happen often. Now I'm wondering if I should have a "sidekick" character in the next book... hmm... On another note, does this apply to the Mentor Death Syndrome in many stories? The death of the Mentor forces the hero to venture forth into the world on their own, with their new, feeble powers, thus raising the stakes and suspicion over whether the hero will attain the goal.

Author:	Airianna Valenshia [ July 14th, 2011, 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I would say it is the same kind of thing, E. Honestly, I don't think I could bring myself to kill most of my "sidekicks". I call them supporting characters though...

Author:	Svensteel Mimetes [ July 14th, 2011, 2:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
It depends on the situation, if the story is about five people who go shopping for fruit, I won't kill anyone off. If it is about people going into outerspace and killing off a million angry zombie-aliens then; I will kill someone off.

Author:	Bethany Faith [ July 14th, 2011, 3:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
* whispers * I just killed a sidekick at the end of one of my books... Personally, though, I kill both sidekicks, MCs, non-existent characters, baby bunnies... * cough * And other things that breathe, but I don't kill them unless I have a point, a reason, and it benefits the storyline or the reader. And I probably just repeated what somebody said... Because I was skimming, but, yeah, my two cents.

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ July 14th, 2011, 8:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Yeah, reasons are important. But I think I talk about that somewhere else. There is a very, very good reason for every death, however significant in every one of my stories. And if there isn't a reason point it out to me and I'll invent one.

Author:	BushMaid [ July 14th, 2011, 10:24 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Bethany Faith wrote: * whispers * I just killed a sidekick at the end of one of my books... Tell me it wasn't in one of the 'what lies in the dark' sequel/s!! shakes Bethy Tell me it wasn't! Lady Eruwaedhiel wrote: On another note, does this apply to the Mentor Death Syndrome in many stories? The death of the Mentor forces the hero to venture forth into the world on their own, with their new, feeble powers, thus raising the stakes and suspicion over whether the hero will attain the goal. I guess this does apply to that, Lady E. Although I'm not sure which is worse; because mentors are often very likable characters. One of the prime examples I have in mind (and forgive me, it's a movie) is the role of one of the characters in the BBC tv series "Hornblower". pokes Airi This one was a brilliant supporting character, and his death seemed pointless, and tragic. Of course in a world like that, I guess death was often inevitable (even for the "good guys") but the happily-ever-after corner of me always hopes for these brilliant characters to live on.

Author:	Bethany Faith [ July 15th, 2011, 8:41 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
is shaken puts on automated voice I'm sorry, that information cannot be released at this time because it is a major story spoiler. If you wish to find out what character died you will...eventually.

Author:	Svensteel Mimetes [ July 15th, 2011, 10:24 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Hmph! I must get a copy of your book! If only I had money!!!

Author:	BushMaid [ July 16th, 2011, 6:53 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
has a horrible sinking feeling...

Author:	Varon [ July 16th, 2011, 11:22 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
It's part of the hero's journey. The mentor or support has to disappear so the hero can become a hero on his/her own.

Author:	Lady Eruwaedhiel [ July 16th, 2011, 2:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
'zactly, Varon. But is the Sidekick separate from the Mentor, or are they two different story roles?

Author:	Varon [ July 16th, 2011, 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Two roles which can be combined into one.

Author:	Lady Eruwaedhiel [ July 17th, 2011, 10:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
True.

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ July 24th, 2011, 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
I view the sidekick and mentor as different roles. For some reasons, I picture sidekicks as usually being younger/having a relationship w/ the MC that is mainly for comic relief and whatnot. The mentor usually doesn't fit into that role, IMO eru

Author:	BushMaid [ July 24th, 2011, 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
True, Eru. The sidekick is usually a tag-along for the MC, but a mentor is the MC's... well, mentor. The difference is hard to put into words...

Author:	Aeleknight [ July 24th, 2011, 11:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
BushMaid wrote: True, Eru. The sidekick is usually a tag-along for the MC, but a mentor is the MC's... well, mentor. The difference is hard to put into words... For those who do not understand let me speak in a language we all should understand very well: Lord of the Rings. Frodo is the main character, Sam, Pippin and Merry are some examples of sidekicks (Sam is the primary one though) and Gandalf is a mentor. I hope this makes sense.

Author:	BushMaid [ July 24th, 2011, 11:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
Unfortunately, that is a language only I do not understand. However, I have a similar series that works the same: Ranger's Apprentice. Will is the MC. Horace is a sidekick, and Halt is the mentor.

Author:	Andrew Amnon Mimetes [ July 25th, 2011, 8:15 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
@Bush: Exactly. Of course, you have other people who are occasionally the sidekick as well, like Alyss or others eru

Author:	Constable Jaynin Mimetes [ July 25th, 2011, 10:32 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
And sometimes Halt is the MC and Will is the sidekick. (Will is generally the MC. But if Halt were, than Will would become a sidekick... ah, never mind me.)

Author:	BushMaid [ July 25th, 2011, 5:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
laughs I forgot there were some other RA fans here! And yes, it was going through my head when I posted that that yes, Halt is often more-so the MC, and other sidekicks include Alyss, Evanlyn, Gilan, etc. This is one series where the sidekick or mentor doesn't die! And look how awesome it is! Many people may condemn this series because none of the main characters, sidekicks, mentor etc. die, thus being deemed "unrealistic". For me though; this is exactly why I love it! What do you guys think? Is it unrealistic for a series to end with all its main characters still in tact? Or do you find a book better if it is more life-like? (and usually, not so happy?)

Author:	Leandra Falconwing [ July 25th, 2011, 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Dead Sidekick Syndrome
agrees with Vanya It totally depends on the book(s). Not every story needs to have one of the good guys die in order to be "realistic." Look at what fits the story and the tone of the story first. If a death wouldn't fit well or would completely change the tone, don't have the death happen. does not often kill her characters and doesn't really think that's ruined her books yet