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 Post subject: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 7th, 2013, 9:20 am 
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I'm hoping to expand my current fantasy novel into more than just one book - we'll see. It's what I'm hoping for, but whether it will be a trilogy or just a follow on I'm not sure of yet. However, I was wondering whether to change MC's in the second book, maybe even move over to another race and tell that book from their POV. Has anyone tried this before, and how did it work out for them? I'll have to finish the first draft of my current book before I fully decide, but was thinking on it a little today.

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Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king

J. R. R. Tolkien


My favourite quote: "God will give His kindness for you to use when your own runs out."

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 7th, 2013, 9:25 am 
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I've not tried this before, but I have seen instances where it works very well. I wouldn't advise a change midway through a series though. I think it works best from book to book, since if you were to do several books with the same MC, readers become attached to them, and become bored with a newly introduced MC because they are still attached to the old one. That's my experience as a reader, anyway. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 7th, 2013, 12:40 pm 
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I think it partially depends on what you are doing with the trilogy. Are you narrating a specific time-span of your world's history/a specific series of historical events over the course of the books? Then using different MCs can add to the interest of the story, as it allows the readers to see the pieces of history from different people's eyes. However, if you are spreading a single character's story over a couple or more books, it may not work as well, though there are always exceptions.

Personally, the fantasy trilogy I'm in the middle of writing utilizes a different MC for each book. I can't really say if it's working, since I haven't finished the first book yet, but it will have to work, because the overall plot is such that I can't keep my first MC. ;)

I think perhaps one key to changing MCs within a series would be to make sure you introduce them before you get to their book. That way, the readers have already begun to feel a bond with the character before changing to his/her POV. For example, the MC of my second novel shows up about two-thirds of the way through the first, and will be fairly prominent in the remainder, hopefully making it a logical transition to his POV in the next book.

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 7th, 2013, 1:02 pm 
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Raven of the Wood wrote:
I think perhaps one key to changing MCs within a series would be to make sure you introduce them before you get to their book. That way, the readers have already begun to feel a bond with the character before changing to his/her POV.
Yes, in the Riddle of Stars trilogy the second book is from a different character's perspective than the first one, but it was done well, especially since the MC of the second book was introduced and portrayed as important in the first book. I missed the first MC, but it didn't take long to love the second one.


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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 7th, 2013, 4:11 pm 
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(I was sure there was another thread on this exact subject, that I particpated in, but I can't find it now.)

If it's not a trilogy (with one story arc running through the whole thing), there's no particular reason not to make different books focus on different main characters and shift to a different POV character. Except that it means you have to get into yet another character's head. :) (And it's best to do such shifts early, lest readers open a later book expecting "yet another so-and-so" only to find something different.)

If it is a single story going through multiple volumes (even if each is a distinct story in it own right), though, it can be made to work, but it can get mighty tricky. You need to establish in the story why we're going off and following this different character for now.

In The Lord of the Rings, for example, we start off following Frodo, which becomes following the entire Fellowship. And then the Breaking of the Fellowship is described in such a way that any sensible reader would demand to know what happens next to both Frodo and Sam and the others ... and so Tolkien starts following Merry and Pippin and Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas.

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 18th, 2013, 8:13 am 
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BushMaid wrote:
I've not tried this before, but I have seen instances where it works very well. I wouldn't advise a change midway through a series though. I think it works best from book to book, since if you were to do several books with the same MC, readers become attached to them, and become bored with a newly introduced MC because they are still attached to the old one. That's my experience as a reader, anyway. :D


Thanks, Bushy! Okay, I'll keep that in mind. I haven't decided whether I'd want to try it yet anyway, but this will be something I will remember to be aware of. :)

Raven of the Wood wrote:
I think it partially depends on what you are doing with the trilogy. Are you narrating a specific time-span of your world's history/a specific series of historical events over the course of the books? Then using different MCs can add to the interest of the story, as it allows the readers to see the pieces of history from different people's eyes. However, if you are spreading a single character's story over a couple or more books, it may not work as well, though there are always exceptions.

Personally, the fantasy trilogy I'm in the middle of writing utilizes a different MC for each book. I can't really say if it's working, since I haven't finished the first book yet, but it will have to work, because the overall plot is such that I can't keep my first MC. ;)

I think perhaps one key to changing MCs within a series would be to make sure you introduce them before you get to their book. That way, the readers have already begun to feel a bond with the character before changing to his/her POV. For example, the MC of my second novel shows up about two-thirds of the way through the first, and will be fairly prominent in the remainder, hopefully making it a logical transition to his POV in the next book.


Thanks, Zoe;

Hmm, yes it's more of a story about a certain race, one of which is my MC. It was more of a thought of swapping over to another race, have a character who is involved but more of an onlooker to the happenings but I am really not sure if it would work. I'm going to have to finish the first book to see. It's no good changing over to another MC just for the sake of it, it was just something I was contemplating.

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All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king

J. R. R. Tolkien


My favourite quote: "God will give His kindness for you to use when your own runs out."

Pippin's Waggy Tales

Autumn Leaves


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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 18th, 2013, 8:17 am 
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Mistress Rwebhu Kidh wrote:
Raven of the Wood wrote:
I think perhaps one key to changing MCs within a series would be to make sure you introduce them before you get to their book. That way, the readers have already begun to feel a bond with the character before changing to his/her POV.
Yes, in the Riddle of Stars trilogy the second book is from a different character's perspective than the first one, but it was done well, especially since the MC of the second book was introduced and portrayed as important in the first book. I missed the first MC, but it didn't take long to love the second one.


*Nods* I should look into reading that. Uhuh, well I already introduced this character I was thinking of working with, but I've kept it separate as I can't decide whether to put the section in or not.

kingjon wrote:
(I was sure there was another thread on this exact subject, that I particpated in, but I can't find it now.)

If it's not a trilogy (with one story arc running through the whole thing), there's no particular reason not to make different books focus on different main characters and shift to a different POV character. Except that it means you have to get into yet another character's head. :) (And it's best to do such shifts early, lest readers open a later book expecting "yet another so-and-so" only to find something different.)

If it is a single story going through multiple volumes (even if each is a distinct story in it own right), though, it can be made to work, but it can get mighty tricky. You need to establish in the story why we're going off and following this different character for now.

In The Lord of the Rings, for example, we start off following Frodo, which becomes following the entire Fellowship. And then the Breaking of the Fellowship is described in such a way that any sensible reader would demand to know what happens next to both Frodo and Sam and the others ... and so Tolkien starts following Merry and Pippin and Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas.


*Nods* I would say that Frodo is still the MC in those books though, right? I already follow different characters in my book, I just have one who the story revolves mainly around. So I guess I could just continue in that way in my second book, if I feel it goes well in the first.

*Nods* I see what you are saying there, Kingjon; thanks for the advice!

_________________

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king

J. R. R. Tolkien


My favourite quote: "God will give His kindness for you to use when your own runs out."

Pippin's Waggy Tales

Autumn Leaves


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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 18th, 2013, 9:56 am 
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Sure, Stephen Lawhead did it in his Song of Albion trilogy. IMO he should have picked a different character for book 3, but that's just my opinion.

You can swap between multiple POVs in a single book, too. Dragonlance, Robert Jordan, Etc do this. Robin Hobb writes first person with Fitz, so she sticks with him in his books, but like her Liveship trilogy was third person and swapped between characters.

In my five book series, each book is in the POV of one of the core characters. Gives them some development as we steam toward the finale. Working on book 4 at the moment, and just tackling the catgirl's POV.


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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: August 18th, 2013, 4:30 pm 
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Lady Elanor Tinuviel wrote:
kingjon wrote:
In The Lord of the Rings, for example, we start off following Frodo, which becomes following the entire Fellowship. And then the Breaking of the Fellowship is described in such a way that any sensible reader would demand to know what happens next to both Frodo and Sam and the others ... and so Tolkien starts following Merry and Pippin and Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas.


*Nods* I would say that Frodo is still the MC in those books though, right? I already follow different characters in my book, I just have one who the story revolves mainly around.

I would say that Frodo is still a main character, but after the Breaking of the Fellowship we can't say that anyone is the main character. Before that, it's "the story of Frodo and the Nine Walkers"; after that, it's "the story of Nine-Fingered Frodo and the Ring of Doom" alternating with "the story of the return of the King." If Frodo were the main character, we wouldn't spend almost half of each volume without anyone mentioning him more than a handful of times.

So, to decide whether to make any given character a "Main Character," you need to consider whether the story can stand to have your existing Main Character(s) "offscreen" for long periods of time. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: May 20th, 2014, 10:41 am 
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Kessie wrote:
Sure, Stephen Lawhead did it in his Song of Albion trilogy. IMO he should have picked a different character for book 3, but that's just my opinion.

You can swap between multiple POVs in a single book, too. Dragonlance, Robert Jordan, Etc do this. Robin Hobb writes first person with Fitz, so she sticks with him in his books, but like her Liveship trilogy was third person and swapped between characters.

In my five book series, each book is in the POV of one of the core characters. Gives them some development as we steam toward the finale. Working on book 4 at the moment, and just tackling the catgirl's POV.



Thank you for giving these examples, Kessie!

kingjon wrote:
Lady Elanor Tinuviel wrote:
kingjon wrote:
In The Lord of the Rings, for example, we start off following Frodo, which becomes following the entire Fellowship. And then the Breaking of the Fellowship is described in such a way that any sensible reader would demand to know what happens next to both Frodo and Sam and the others ... and so Tolkien starts following Merry and Pippin and Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas.


*Nods* I would say that Frodo is still the MC in those books though, right? I already follow different characters in my book, I just have one who the story revolves mainly around.

I would say that Frodo is still a main character, but after the Breaking of the Fellowship we can't say that anyone is the main character. Before that, it's "the story of Frodo and the Nine Walkers"; after that, it's "the story of Nine-Fingered Frodo and the Ring of Doom" alternating with "the story of the return of the King." If Frodo were the main character, we wouldn't spend almost half of each volume without anyone mentioning him more than a handful of times.

So, to decide whether to make any given character a "Main Character," you need to consider whether the story can stand to have your existing Main Character(s) "offscreen" for long periods of time. :)


So, you're saying it would work not to have a Main Character all the way through? But then would you have a handful of main characters, without any one of them being the main character?

_________________

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king

J. R. R. Tolkien


My favourite quote: "God will give His kindness for you to use when your own runs out."

Pippin's Waggy Tales

Autumn Leaves


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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: May 28th, 2014, 4:23 pm 
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Lady Elanor wrote:
kingjon wrote:
So, to decide whether to make any given character a "Main Character," you need to consider whether the story can stand to have your existing Main Character(s) "offscreen" for long periods of time. :)


So, you're saying it would work not to have a Main Character all the way through? But then would you have a handful of main characters, without any one of them being the main character?

Some stories have a single Main Character, some (and nearly all romance novels) have a Male Lead and a Female Lead, and some have an "ensemble cast" sharing the "lead." And an author can make essentially any size "cast" work. But every moment "in" one character's "head" is a moment we are not "in" any of the others' "heads"---it all comes down to opportunity cost, just like every moment spent checking Holy Worlds is a moment not spent reading or writing.

I've slightly conflated the ideas of Point-of-View and the Character Lead or Protagonist above. It is entirely possible to write a book in which the main character is not the point-of-view character (unfortunately, the one example that leaps to mind is a book I consider to be a waste of the paper its innumerable copies are printed on, so I won't name it here). But essentially the same economics applies to "screen time" as to "head-space time."

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Creator of the Shine Cycle, an expansive fantasy planned series, spanning over two centuries of an imagined world's history, several universes (including various alternate histories and our own future), and the stories of dozens of characters (many from our world).

Developer of Strategic Primer, a strategy/simulation game played by email; currently in a redesign phase after the ending of "the current campaign" in 2022.

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 Post subject: Re: Changing MC's
PostPosted: June 4th, 2014, 11:53 am 
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Lady Elanor wrote:
I'm hoping to expand my current fantasy novel into more than just one book - we'll see. It's what I'm hoping for, but whether it will be a trilogy or just a follow on I'm not sure of yet. However, I was wondering whether to change MC's in the second book, maybe even move over to another race and tell that book from their POV. Has anyone tried this before, and how did it work out for them? I'll have to finish the first draft of my current book before I fully decide, but was thinking on it a little today.


I've been thinking of doing this as well, for my fantasy trilogy. I want to write the first book in Keallan's point of view, and the second book from Ingvar's. For the third, I'm torn between writing it from Terran's point of view or switching back to Keallan's. (They all travel together for the majority of the trilogy, and thus, share the main storyline.) The problem is, I don't know whether that's 'allowed', or whether it works.

As a result, I can't tell you whether it would work out or not - I can tell you that I think I'd enjoy reading a series of books (two, three, four, whatever) that switch MCs. :) Writing such a series, however, might be complicated...


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